[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: [lojban] Re: Gismu in need of place structure extensions



Ignoring the ad hominem, my reasoning is basic linguistic descriptivism. There's nothing malgli about that. Do you have any specific criticisms of specific arguments I make? Do you have a problem with my premises; if so, which ones, and what do you see wrong with them?
On Tuesday, June 30, 2020 at 12:52:31 PM UTC-4 gleki.is...@gmail.com wrote:

Are you a native English speaker? Or some SAE language? I consider your reasoning malgli. Do you speak any East Asia languages?

Em sábado, 27 de junho de 2020 20:52:04 UTC+3, Jmive escreveu:
On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:13:26 AM UTC-4 gleki.is...@gmail.com wrote:
Usage can be incorrect. Take the story of dikyjvo. We don't want Lojban to become a language evolved from incorrect readings of gimste, do we.
oicai malkamdrakembaupevyske. Words mean what people mean by them. {dikyjvo} was an anomalous misnomer that was abandoned in favor of a better alternative that already existed in the language. No such alternative exists for the gaming sense of {kelci}. If {kelci} must not be used to mean "x1 plays a game", then both {kelci'e} and {ci'erkei} are wrong and there has been a gaping semantic hole in the language's lexicon for all of its existence up to this point -- games are a cultural universal; there really ought to be a gismu for that -- and this hole has been de facto filled by {kelci}, in spite of any supposed linguistic imperative that the word absolutely must not be used in such a way.

In such a case it is only sensible to bend to the will of the selbau and define the word in the sense in which it is commonly used. Coining the experimental "x1 plays game x2" would (by your reasoning) also be a poor choice: you would have edit all the old texts and tell everyone to change the way they {kelci}, replacing the previous "incorrect" usage with {pleci}. By your reasoning, we're screwed either way: either all text both past and future must zi'o out kelci3 wherever {kelci} is not being used in the gaming-related sense, or all text both past and future must substitute in the newfangled {pleci} wherever {kelci} is being used in the gaming-related sense.

But again, the semantic change to existing texts could be minimized if we define kelci3 to also apply to playful activities that are not games as such. Play is active, so play taking place logically necessitates that some playful activity is taking place. Behold, both senses of the word are encompassed, and no change to any existing text or usage is necessary.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/lojban/b739a5ed-2f8b-47c7-8dbd-92a043c93fcan%40googlegroups.com.