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Re: [lojban] Re: {zo'e}
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- Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: {zo'e}
- From: Jacob Thomas Errington <jake@mail.jerrington.me>
- Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2021 15:47:26 GMT
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coi
On 2021-01-06 13:04, scope845hlang343jbo@icebubble.org wrote:
If we use your interpretation, then {mi viska zo'e} could mean {mi viska
lo nanmu} but could not mean {mi viska lo na nanmu}. It seems, to me,
that {lo na nanmu} would be a perfectly legitimate meaning for {zo'e}.
My interpretation wouldn't forbid {lo na nanmu} as a referent for
{zo'e}. It forbids {no da (poi whatever)} as a referent for zo'e,
because such a referent makes the (outer) bridi negative.
{mi viska lo na nanmu} is an affirmative statement, that I see
something that satisfies (the negative) {na nanmu}.
On the other hand
{mi viska no (da poi) nanmu} is a negative statement, that I do not
see anything that satisfies (the affirmative) {nanmu}.
The crucial difference is that in the former, I do say I'm seeing
something, and that thing is identified by not being a {nanmu}; whereas
in the latter I am merely denying seeing any {nanmu}. In other words,
the latter is a claim of _not seeing_, versus the former being a claim
of _seeing_.
See
https://lojban.org/publications/cll/cll_v1.1_xhtml-section-chunks/section-negation-boundaries.html#example-random-id-fpeW
in particular the paragraph below example 16.70 explaining that {no da}
is replaced with {naku su'o da}.
Now I hope my reason for saying {no da (poi whatever)} can't be what
{zo'e} stands for is clear: if (implicit) {zo'e} can stand for {noda},
then a claim such as {mi viska (zo'e)} could actually mean that I
_don't_ see! And to me, that is totally bonkers.
zo do'e ki'a
Many cmavo ending in {o'e} are 'elliptical' in Lojban (with the
egregious exception of {.o'e} itself). {do'e} is the elliptical modal,
which stands for some BAI/fi'o.
.i mi'e la tsani mu'o
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