From a.rosta@lycos.co.uk Wed Mar 05 19:48:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 03:48:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 37880 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 03:48:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 03:48:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 03:48:11 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.12) id 18qmMd-0006UG-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:48:11 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18qmLd-0006Tl-00; Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:47:09 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:47:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from lmsmtp02.st1.spray.net ([212.78.202.112]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18qmLW-0006Tc-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:47:02 -0800 Received: from oemcomputer (host81-7-53-121.surfport24.v21.co.uk [81.7.53.121]) by lmsmtp02.st1.spray.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5657E5B857 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 04:46:30 +0100 (MET) To: "lojban-list" Subject: [lojban] Re: The Any thread Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 03:46:08 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Importance: Normal X-archive-position: 4388 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: a.rosta@lycos.co.uk Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: "And Rosta" Reply-To: a.rosta@lycos.co.uk X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=122260811 X-Yahoo-Profile: andjamin Craig: > >whereas "I need a book" (on the so-called ANY/'opaque' reading) > >IS falsified by "There is a (real or imaginary) book that I don't need" > > Umm... no. "I need a doctor." I have a need which will be filled if I am > attended to by Dr. Foo. However, I could equally well accept the services of > Dr. Bar, so I don't actually need Dr. Foo. I need a doctor, according to my > view of lo, is "mi nitcu lo mikce". However, "zasti falo mikce poi mi ke'a > na nitcu" is still true - I don't actually need Dr. Foo since Dr. Bar can > treat me Rephrase what I said to: whereas "I need a book" (on the so-called ANY/'opaque' reading) IS falsified by "There is a (real or imaginary) book does not satisfy my need" and my point will be made more clearly. As I said in an earlier message, your claim that "I need a doctor" is "mi nitcu lo mikce" is wrong, to the extent that the mapping from simple Lojban bridi to logical formulas is uncontroversial. However, I do not claim that that mapping is uncontroversial. All the same, as I said in my earlier message, if the controvery were officially resolved, I am confident that (for the sake of consistency) it would be resolved in such a way as to make "mi nitcu lo mikce" mean "there is a doctor that satisfies my need". --And.