From xod@sixgirls.org Thu Oct 26 13:13:08 2000 Return-Path: X-Sender: xod@sixgirls.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@egroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-6_2_0); 26 Oct 2000 20:13:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 32495 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2000 20:12:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by m4.onelist.org with QMQP; 26 Oct 2000 20:12:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO erika.sixgirls.org) (209.208.150.50) by mta1 with SMTP; 26 Oct 2000 20:12:53 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by erika.sixgirls.org (8.11.0+3.3W/8.9.3) with ESMTP id e9QKCqE21950 for ; Thu, 26 Oct 2000 16:12:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2000 16:12:51 -0400 (EDT) To: lojban@egroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] RE: literalism In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Invent Yourself On Thu, 26 Oct 2000, Jorge Llambias wrote: > > la xod cusku di'e > > > > i ma smuni lu melbi fatci li'u do > > > >beautiful truth; a truth I think is beautiful. > > i oi xruti le glico xenru > You don't explain how a beautiful truth is different > from beautiful and true. It is beautiful and true, but I don't think the truth is beautiful. Big difference! > >What I said resembled "It's been real, and it's been good, but it hasn't > >been real good!" > > No, it doesn't. That's playing with two different senses > of "real". "It's been real" means that it actually happened, > "real good" means "extremely good" and has little to do with > actuality. If you claim that the {melbi fatci} sentence is > something like that, then you'd be saying that {melbi} has > two different meanings, is that what you mean? No. > What I supposed you may have wanted to say is that the > sentence as written was a beautiful thing, a beautiful > sentence, and also a true one, but that the meaning > expressed was not to your liking, not beautiful. > That's the difference between {di'u} and {la'e di'u}. > The sentence and its meaning. Well this difference is why I used the word "resemble". Can a sentence be true? Or is only its meaning true, and a sentence has no truth value? That topic will surely last us a few weeks of debate, no? ----- "...widespread, systematic and gross violations of human rights perpetrated by the Israeli occupying power, in particular mass killings...measures which constitute...crimes against humanity.'' UN Commission on Human Rights, 19 Oct 2000