From Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de Sat Dec 16 09:42:31 2000 Return-Path: X-Sender: Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de X-Apparently-To: lojban@egroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-6_3_1_3); 16 Dec 2000 17:42:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 69796 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2000 17:42:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by m8.onelist.org with QMQP; 16 Dec 2000 17:42:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mr.egroups.com) (10.1.1.37) by mta1 with SMTP; 16 Dec 2000 17:42:30 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de Received: from [10.1.2.113] by mr.egroups.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2000 17:42:28 -0000 Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 17:42:23 -0000 To: lojban@egroups.com Subject: Re: detri Message-ID: <91g9hv+u0m7@eGroups.com> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1350 X-Mailer: eGroups Message Poster X-Originating-IP: 193.149.49.79 From: "=?iso-8859-1?q?Alfred_W._Tueting_(T=FCting)?=" --- In lojban@egroups.com, "Jorge Llambias" wrote: > i la lojban so'iroi se pajmanci je'e .i go'i > {fi'o se nenri ko'a} means "inside ko'a". > {fi'o nenri ko'a} means "having ko'a inside". > > In general {fi'o broda ko'a} puts ko'a in the x1 place of > broda, that is explained in the book. You may be suggesting > a different interpretation, but in that case please be more > explicit on how it would work in general. I suppose you don't > want {nenri} to be an exception to the general rule. > > If you don't include {be}, then what you are saying is that > the discovery occurs inside the soup, not that the fly is > inside the soup. Xod's use of {be} was correct. You're right, of course! I should have looked into the Book before! 1) I didn't consider the different 1st places of fi'o nenri and ne'i, 2) was puzzled by the use of {be} and {fi'o}/{ne'i} together. My (erroneous) feeling was, that {be} just can "activate" a given selbri place, whereas {fi'o} /{ne'i} create an additional one. So, since {facki} doesn't have this place, {be} seemed inappropriate together with {fi'o}. Yet, now I see, it's the other way round: ti sfani ne'i le mi stasu/ti sfani fi'o se nenri le mi stasu (step 1) mi viska pa sfani be fi'o se nenri le mi stasu/mi viska lo sfani be ne'i le mi stasu (step 2) ki'e co'o mi'e la .aulun.