Received: from mail-pa0-f58.google.com ([209.85.220.58]:58298)
	by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
	(Exim 4.80.1)
	(envelope-from <bpfk-list+bncBCGJHDV3NEIP5MEUUICRUBC4RREB4@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1XgDi9-0000Ua-1h; Mon, 20 Oct 2014 07:13:35 -0700
Received: by mail-pa0-f58.google.com with SMTP id rd3sf921213pab.13
        for <multiple recipients>; Mon, 20 Oct 2014 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806;
        h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version:in-reply-to
         :user-agent:sender:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe
         :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition;
        bh=2+ooJxa5QLoXpFqfekrnO1g/dADm+rbvP/yvDeCO39I=;
        b=fjh8J7eQliUa6wIfyVESGL9Z242J/ftOMKruBjyRmGYvcFJekL0y3U6Aj28wJBseKT
         kD5VRmswmuP9GlCzI1uxe8bF3/+eg2xTF8e9aMg6xQh9882oHo6mU8t/NAnGqZ05QDfG
         X2jGPMwQozXGfiyo6Ac0OMUHTpEZquADevyEFClEGb5BaA7meQlAWKds8OEJ2FsZqcUt
         4sEo2SSnXmnj3tINM+uoHP2f8d/hSfIbr0gwN+68f4wnlh9hM5d5AzCSr1r5Y525rf8J
         bAiOUGyh6ro59l8KzsTTQnICKcuc7aFHMmfkh+zxO4YF7MxELNwlYZz2L2pA1jB8+bmW
         oWuA==
X-Received: by 10.182.107.232 with SMTP id hf8mr4855obb.36.1413814398538;
        Mon, 20 Oct 2014 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
X-BeenThere: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.182.44.168 with SMTP id f8ls757026obm.81.gmail; Mon, 20 Oct
 2014 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 10.182.71.66 with SMTP id s2mr19053344obu.44.1413814398359;
        Mon, 20 Oct 2014 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org. [192.190.237.11])
        by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id tr5si562272igb.1.2014.10.20.07.13.18
        for <bpfk-list@googlegroups.com>
        (version=TLSv1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
        Mon, 20 Oct 2014 07:13:18 -0700 (PDT)
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of cowan@ccil.org designates 192.190.237.11 as permitted sender) client-ip=192.190.237.11;
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.72)
	(envelope-from <cowan@ccil.org>)
	id 1XgDi1-0003fW-GP
	for bpfk-list@googlegroups.com; Mon, 20 Oct 2014 10:13:17 -0400
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2014 10:13:17 -0400
From: John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org>
To: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [bpfk] official cmavo form
Message-ID: <20141020141316.GD14499@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <f9d06e26-31b2-43ac-897e-b3a21db84dad@googlegroups.com>
 <CAO7tK2eCaqLe2L7wJh7FmP2CW8BkL==jtm1nBqAbvjUbDC2syQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <5444FEBF.10200@gmx.de>
 <544507CD.9050608@gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <544507CD.9050608@gmail.com>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14)
Sender: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com
X-Original-Sender: cowan@ccil.org
X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com;       spf=pass
 (google.com: domain of cowan@ccil.org designates 192.190.237.11 as permitted
 sender) smtp.mail=cowan@ccil.org
Reply-To: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list bpfk-list@googlegroups.com; contact bpfk-list+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <bpfk-list.googlegroups.com>
X-Google-Group-Id: 972099695765
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list/post>, <mailto:bpfk-list@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/>, <mailto:bpfk-list+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list/subscribe>, <mailto:bpfk-list+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:googlegroups-manage+972099695765+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>,
 <http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list/subscribe>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-)
X-Spam_score: -1.9
X-Spam_score_int: -18
X-Spam_bar: -

And Rosta scripsit:

> Why must Lojban have onsets and syllabification? /Cia/ is problematic
> only if /Ci-/ must constitute an onset.

It's settled that "ia" is /ja/.

> >I see no problems with {ie'o} as a cmavo form.

I agree.

> How about {a'ua}?

By avoiding things like this, we keep Lojban /h/ safely ambisyllabic.
Allowing /ahwa/ means we have to choose between coda /h/ (hard for
anglophones and many others) and onset /hw/ (hard for most anglophones,
who no longer have a /w/ ~ /W/ distinction).

We have no shortage of possible cmavo.  Let's not go toward hC or Ch
clusters (where C = any consonant including /j/ and /w/).

> I think Lojban already has way more phonotactic constraints than is
> necessary...

I wish we had more, but our lujvo-making machinery prevents some that
would be really useful, like not allowing both "denbro" and "dembro".

-- 
John Cowan          http://www.ccil.org/~cowan        cowan@ccil.org
What asininity could I have uttered that they applaud me thus?
        --Phocion, Greek orator

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "BPFK" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bpfk-list+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to bpfk-list@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.