Received: from localhost ([::1]:41995 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1bIAMg-0007nS-L3; Wed, 29 Jun 2016 00:56:56 -0700 Received: from mail-lf0-f43.google.com ([209.85.215.43]:36559) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1bIAMZ-0007mP-Iu for llg-board@lojban.org; Wed, 29 Jun 2016 00:56:52 -0700 Received: by mail-lf0-f43.google.com with SMTP id q132so27527134lfe.3 for ; Wed, 29 Jun 2016 00:56:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dfWbHTrjrdajoPSBdfem5eVFc0iG1BfinxYHwHhkId4=; b=vgSZ3y63Xlh3P31Ilt5ZYtpuY5IccePEjleT/+uIT9fDNDFN9uMbgesNbuZ0VzS23e WmkjhZkhFhhCY62PsogDniH6fOKScMLpVXLEgt/wOC9wvajdqdheer49s3nJcmrZSX+l GFdOK1kE9DJncZFGkWQKGnK9WMcB9BL6rNo400nPKbuc1jsWhSJ892fdGrcOoiG5AggJ +/WLm5ivSkY/yNWPXuq2mLNpqKCoVZ0F8PjHtytKm44q9wrINNhH2y1CvxtwHxUBD+UN JaH6L0Ni4cg+aiw7QFMk5FfN9st+jyMXzO6rwjq/sqrK/x0vWeRUpm8OdytjSTv+525a eSBg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=dfWbHTrjrdajoPSBdfem5eVFc0iG1BfinxYHwHhkId4=; b=b2KbKCjR0j/EPcPVnTyd/WZDhOX45xVSlVWDiHhCBjqVZG5hFwOl0BaJ5Lz8wrYOls /68Xn/Ek4ESc3hdHjLd/qvV3ZlyoXuFhnqNXyIwde0aDg0JG30fNU6O4Z9gmYzpefDZ9 3qVjhcUyAwOarkDI/RXHEqXTTO81gQdhpsKE8XVXVRzscp+erEwfZGGqTsU03FuNa9I5 HsGH5VnqZgaBgcjA9bV0QjpKJXLjE20Nt5skT3gUoaaEvKy3TZl8KbCyCP0BQhXfwdR2 PFYVvy23nhYdPW6BXQj749bL1RCNs++dln6j0g/sH1uSFgsUsxLcvvE5uqE+jifA2Y9D CUvA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tJbycm8HIFQkmRwyyCZrmwznjcrzPgGKCZaEkJansKzhnT83eQuaIr57ERk0wRY170JbI6nFeLYjeAv0A== X-Received: by 10.25.88.146 with SMTP id m140mr2162766lfb.217.1467187000202; Wed, 29 Jun 2016 00:56:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.25.24.164 with HTTP; Wed, 29 Jun 2016 00:56:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <33ef899e-478f-eee0-1e8e-38e71ccfbc26@lojban.org> From: Gleki Arxokuna Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2016 10:56:00 +0300 Message-ID: To: llg-board@lojban.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Spam_score: -2.0 X-Spam_score_int: -19 X-Spam_bar: -- Subject: Re: [llg-board] Volunteers and qualifications for office X-BeenThere: llg-board@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-board@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============3708880273122306281==" Errors-To: llg-board-bounces@lojban.org --===============3708880273122306281== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11416c20f75bc20536661720 --001a11416c20f75bc20536661720 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 2016-06-29 10:31 GMT+03:00 Curtis Franks : > I hesitate to assume for myself, in the absence of any competition or even > commentary, the office of President because I do not want to seem like I am > reaching or trying to amass power and, equally importantly, I recognize > that I lack the familiarity and experience that may be desired for the > executor of the role; moreover, I have not demonstrated in the final months > of the last meeting, any skill or experience in consensus-building or > successful legislation-drafting - in fact, I realize that I was a startling > failure in these domains. I understand that this performance was > uninspiring, contentious, and unhelpful. I will try to improve no matter > what my role. > We all need to improve ourselves. I don't see how the existence of LLG *CURRENTLY* justifies itself. Observing heroic work of one man (=Robin) is definitely not a great job. It's a luck we have a person for an important position of the treasurer. It was a luck we had Robin for "face of Lojban community". And we don't have anyone like that now. Currently I think the only concern should be: who will run the meetings. Everything else in my view should not have any degree of officiality unless we get people not just ready to do but actualy doing and COMPLETING anything officially. But as of now even BPFK is dormant (so the new version of CLL isn't gonna arrive soon). > All that I can say for my prior conduct was that I was trying to be > constructive and active - to do something and to avoid pitfalls in the > process. I do think that I can do a good job in any office that I hold if I > am given guidance, assistance, patience, and perhaps some direction. I will > conduct myself more appropriately as I observe and judge, and as I am > advised, in such a role. But I also understand that I have far from earned > the trust of my peers. > In the conditions where LLG has renewed ~90% of its membership during the last few years... how else could it be? I do not want to bring doubt or grievance to management of this > organization. I do not want people to lose faith in it. It may be the case > that my recognizing these things - my failings and weaknesses - and my > pledge to consciously improve with respect to them may secure for myself > some small fraction of faith from others. > I think for safeness you could assert that your position would be temporary. As I understand even Lojbab HAD TO take the position of the president back (because no one else wanted anymore? right?) The fact that this "temporariness" lasts for many years is explained by what we all know. > Still, I believe that, unless another course is necessary, a gradual > transition would be best. That way, I can test the waters and others can > test me. I am more keen on the Vice-Presidential role as a result. But I > also understand Lojbab's reluctance in continuing his present office and > that some large degree of power-sharing is likely; I imagine that (should > he retain his present role) he will begin and then bring me up to speed in > efforts, history, style, and advice for conduct. Then, he will guide me and > step in occasionally, as he deems desirable or necessary, gradually phasing > out almost entirely as the meeting proceeds; I will increase in presence in > inverse proportion. Of course, he may choose to do otherwise - he does not > need my welcome here, and especially not my permission, but he has both in > abundance. > A technical position of someone running the meeting and therefore remembering all the bylaws would be fine. As I understood we simply don't have anyone but Lojbab and John Cowan who can do that. I would be happy we had one more person who can run the meetings. Otherwise what? Dissolve LLG? > In short, I happily, although somewhat reservedly and self-consciously, > nominate myself for the office of Vice-President. I hope to be admirably > vigorous in my intention, but also wise in its conduct. If absolutely > desired by the community or necessary by development of events, I will take > the office of President with more reservation. > I approve of your candidacy for the Vice-President. I do still welcome others to nominate alternatives who may be more > qualified and demonstratedly trustworthy. I will do my very best, but I > understand my perception and position. I offer myself, essentially, as a > willing last-resort. > On Jun 25, 2016 19:53, "Curtis Franks" wrote: > >> I agree about the timing and will hold off for a few days so that others >> may comment or join the process. >> On Jun 25, 2016 19:45, "Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG" < >> lojbab@lojban.org> wrote: >> >>> So Riley has volunteered as both Secretary and Treasurer, and no one >>> else has. >>> >>> Curtis has said he would be interested in either President or Vice >>> President. >>> >>> I'm willing to be President for another year, but I'm not enthusiastic >>> because I don't think I did a very good job this past year, and am not sure >>> I can do better in the coming year. I guess the same would be true for >>> Vice President. I can also imagine Curtis as VP to me as President, and my >>> largely delegating the job to him, at least insofar as *active* >>> leadership. But if he feels up to the Presidency as it is, maybe he would >>> be the better choice for President. (My inactivity doesn't suggest any >>> obvious role for me as VP other than as a name to fill the slot.) >>> >>> If no one else speaks up for any office (maybe allow another day or two >>> at most), I suggest that someone move a particular slate, rather than >>> holding an election where there aren't multiple candidates. Curtis is >>> probably the best one to make such a motion since he knows best which of >>> the two top jobs he is more willing/interested in to serve, but anyone can >>> make the motion. >>> >>> lojbab >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> llg-board mailing list >>> llg-board@lojban.org >>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-board >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > llg-board mailing list > llg-board@lojban.org > http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-board > > --001a11416c20f75bc20536661720 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


2016-06-29 10:31 GMT+03:00 Curtis Franks <curtis.w.franks@gma= il.com>:

I h= esitate to assume for myself, in the absence of any competition or even com= mentary, the office of President because I do not want to seem like I am re= aching or trying to amass power and, equally importantly, I recognize that = I lack the familiarity and experience that may be desired for the executor = of the role; moreover, I have not demonstrated in the final months of the l= ast meeting, any skill or experience in consensus-building or successful le= gislation-drafting - in fact, I realize that I was a startling failure in t= hese domains. I understand that this performance was uninspiring, contentio= us, and unhelpful. I will try to improve no matter what my role.


We all need to improve ourselves. I don't see= how the existence of LLG *CURRENTLY* =C2=A0justifies itself.
Obs= erving heroic work of one man (=3DRobin) is definitely not a great job.

It's a luck we have a person for an important pos= ition of the treasurer.
It was a luck we had Robin for "face= of Lojban community". And we don't have anyone like that now.

Currently I think the only concern should be: who wil= l run the meetings.

Everything else in my view sho= uld not have any degree of officiality unless we get people not just ready = to do but actualy doing and COMPLETING anything officially. But as of now e= ven BPFK is dormant (so the new version of CLL isn't gonna arrive soon)= .

All that I can say fo= r my prior conduct was that I was trying to be constructive and active - to= do something and to avoid pitfalls in the process. I do think that I can d= o a good job in any office that I hold if I am given guidance, assistance, = patience, and perhaps some direction. I will conduct myself more appropriat= ely as I observe and judge, and as I am advised, in such a role. But I also= understand that I have far from earned the trust of my peers.

In the conditions where LLG has renewed ~90% of its membership dur= ing the last few years... how else could it be?

I do not want to bring doubt or gri= evance to management of this organization. I do not want people to lose fai= th in it. It may be the case that my recognizing these things - my failings= and weaknesses - and my pledge to consciously improve with respect to them= may secure for myself some small fraction of faith from others.


I think for safeness you could assert that your p= osition would be temporary.
As I understand even Lojbab HAD TO ta= ke the position of the president back (because no one else wanted anymore? = right?) The fact that this "temporariness" lasts for many years i= s explained by what we all know.

Still, I believe that, unless another course is necessary, a= gradual transition would be best. That way, I can test the waters and othe= rs can test me. I am more keen on the Vice-Presidential role as a result. B= ut I also understand Lojbab's reluctance in continuing his present offi= ce and that some large degree of power-sharing is likely; I imagine that (s= hould he retain his present role) he will begin and then bring me up to spe= ed in efforts, history, style, and advice for conduct. Then, he will guide = me and step in occasionally, as he deems desirable or necessary, gradually = phasing out almost entirely as the meeting proceeds; I will increase in pre= sence in inverse proportion. Of course, he may choose to do otherwise - he = does not need my welcome here, and especially not my permission, but he has= both in abundance.

A technical position of someone ru= nning the meeting and therefore remembering all the bylaws would be fine.
As I understood we simply don't have anyone but Lojbab and Joh= n Cowan who can do that.

I would be happy we had o= ne more person who can run the meetings. Otherwise what? Dissolve LLG?
<= /div>
=C2=A0

In short, I happily, although somewhat reservedly and self-c= onsciously, nominate myself for the office of Vice-President. I hope to be = admirably vigorous in my intention, but also wise in its conduct. If absolu= tely desired by the community or necessary by development of events, I will= take the office of President with more reservation.

<= br>
I approve of your candidacy for the Vice-President.

I do still welcome others to nominate alternatives who may b= e more qualified and demonstratedly trustworthy. I will do my very best, bu= t I understand my perception and position. I offer myself, essentially, as = a willing last-resort.

On Jun 25, 2016 19:53, "Curtis Franks"= <curtis.= w.franks@gmail.com> wrote:

I agree about the timing and will hold off for= a few days so that others may comment or join the process.

On Jun 25, 2016 19:45, "Bob LeChevalier, Pr= esident and Founder - LLG" <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote:
So Riley has volunteered as both Secretary and= Treasurer, and no one else has.

Curtis has said he would be interested in either President or Vice Presiden= t.

I'm willing to be President for another year, but I'm not enthusias= tic because I don't think I did a very good job this past year, and am = not sure I can do better in the coming year.=C2=A0 I guess the same would b= e true for Vice President.=C2=A0 I can also imagine Curtis as VP to me as P= resident, and my largely delegating the job to him, at least insofar as *ac= tive* leadership.=C2=A0 But if he feels up to the Presidency as it is, mayb= e he would be the better choice for President. (My inactivity doesn't s= uggest any obvious role for me as VP other than as a name to fill the slot.= )

If no one else speaks up for any office=C2=A0 (maybe allow another day or t= wo at most), I suggest that someone move a particular slate, rather than ho= lding an election where there aren't multiple candidates.=C2=A0 Curtis = is probably the best one to make such a motion since he knows best which of= the two top jobs he is more willing/interested in to serve, but anyone can= make the motion.

lojbab



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http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-board

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llg-board@lojban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-board


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