From matt.mattarn@gmail.com Fri Oct 27 20:52:26 2006 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list llg-board); Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:52:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.186]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1GdfF7-00007Q-Ea for llg-board@lojban.org; Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:52:24 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id p46so2215106nfa for ; Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:52:19 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=TyYHRmBNfmI1cS1Gpd69h1A9kFhJ+gjJk5I+tCrJzA9bp4LJGphNcCCzc29zjiqpK8BJiMschbwPgA4XSyro579b2atmf48lSy5JQ0jlJS2swSqUiou7q6O6tvBJCDu+84k7N/+f89zIbTStYcpwfVGVL+ZrplkoB1pmVx8EpGY= Received: by 10.78.136.9 with SMTP id j9mr684670hud; Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.144.3 with HTTP; Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2006 23:52:19 -0400 From: "Matt Arnold" To: llg-board@lojban.org Subject: [llg-board] Re: Motion to officially recognize new art In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) X-archive-position: 197 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: matt.mattarn@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: llg-board@lojban.org X-list: llg-board I remind Arnt and Lojbab that I am not talking about rejecting or repudiating the existing symbol. On 10/27/06, Arnt Richard Johansen wrote: > - Are there examples of corporations, especially non-profit ones, that > have benefitted from having two different logos/flags/emblems/insignia? Yes. Look at the Olympic logos from 1932 on. It's very similar to the arrangement I'm proposing, although I don't want to change as often. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_logos The science fiction conventions I am involved with also usually get a new logo every year. Often they have a standard character who remains consistent in their wildly varying themes from year to year. > - Are there examples of corporations, especially non-profit ones, that > have benefitted from completely abandoning an established logo, and > adopted a new one that is completely visually and conceptually > disparate? Klingons are the most important example I can cite. Their costume is their language's visual identity, and Star Trek: The Next Generation radically updated the look of the Klingon species in a successful way. Other examples include the National Audobon Society and the British phone company Alltell. Kodak completely radically replaced their logo this year. Sprint had a blue "speeding diamond" symbol for a couple of decades and switched it to a symbol of a pin dropping on a yellow background. For the first sixty years, Pepsi's logo looked like the cursive Coca-Cola and didn't have the red/white/blue circle with sans-serif block font. AT&T's recent logo change was just a minor update, but before their Death Star it was a bell. Look at what NBC's logo used to be like before the peacock: http://www.art.unt.edu/ntieva/news/vol_15/no_1/LogoLogic.swf That series illustrates a trend I've noticed in most organizations and companies before they became very large. They decide on a quick-and-sloppy logo early on, and transition to a very professionalistic one when they become prominent enough for large numbers of eyeballs to be directed at them. We just don't have a powerful enough brand right now to be losing very much in the eyes of the public. Unlike Klingon, we hardly have any public yet. But we will. Consider the following: The advent of what may be the biggest in-person meeting of enthusiasts in its fifty-year history. The largest-ever local groups meeting regularly in Michigan, Grinnell college in Iowa, and the Maine School of Science and Mathematics. The imminent advent of a whole slate of exciting web applications. An entire original novel. Plans for Lojbanimation which could become virally popular among non-Lojban speakers. The peak of organized internet activity. With the above milestones I personally believe that Lojban is crossing a self-reinforcing publicity threshhold. We need not just an icon, but a logotype (a logo into which we can fit the name and tagline of our brand) or it doesn't communicate much to a new viewer. Now is the crucial moment in which it's about to become important but since it hasn't yet we don't stand as much to lose. -Eppcott