From lojbab@lojban.org Wed Mar 11 13:59:25 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list llg-board); Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:59:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eastrmmtao103.cox.net ([68.230.240.9]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1LhVWI-0005oz-6K for llg-board@lojban.org; Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:59:25 -0700 Received: from eastrmimpo02.cox.net ([68.1.16.120]) by eastrmmtao103.cox.net (InterMail vM.7.08.02.01 201-2186-121-102-20070209) with ESMTP id <20090311205912.CRF21373.eastrmmtao103.cox.net@eastrmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:59:12 -0400 Received: from [192.168.1.100] ([70.187.235.94]) by eastrmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id RwzB1b00T22sj6m02wzBy4; Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:59:12 -0400 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=wbiUy1uqjgoA:10 a=mRcMyuhkYd8A:10 a=QIwYcvivJTNymez1ec8A:9 a=ipZAafyDaDvo36OfydgA:7 a=Lv1nxWkRCKb7sXclIR99ErbfQuEA:4 a=vNGxQsTWjH8A:10 a=qPAkA2gC-80VgRme:21 a=HWK4Ix3BMJs4kh0I:21 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: <49B8269E.4060103@lojban.org> Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 17:01:18 -0400 From: Robert LeChevalier User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: llg-board@lojban.org Subject: [llg-board] Re: Spending money on getting people to penguicon. References: <20090305191021.GE27391@digitalkingdom.org> <49B03EEA.3050305@lojban.org> <20090305212839.GI27391@digitalkingdom.org> <49B0473D.2060508@lojban.org> <20090305214356.GJ27391@digitalkingdom.org> <49B06356.9080901@lojban.org> <20090305235619.GO27391@digitalkingdom.org> <49B789EF.8060402@lojban.org> <20090311103021.GT7405@nvg.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 494 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lojbab@lojban.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: llg-board@lojban.org X-list: llg-board Matt Arnold wrote: > Exposure on xkcd and internet word-of-mouth are driving all the > traffic we need, for free. At our current level of ability to support the community, I agree. > But we're losing them because of incomplete > areas. For instance, if they don't get a satisfactory answer to what > "le" means and so on and so forth. Meeting in person keeps the core of > our group excited, increasing the momentum we need to finish BPFK, > create a dictionary, update the reference materials, and launch Lojban > learning software on the web, thereby keeping more of the people who > find us. I agree that LogFests are a good thing and well justified - I did institute the practice of regular gatherings, after all. The question is what level of expenditure is justified for one such meeting, and in particular for a small number of those who are attending. I rather doubt the Penguicon could occur if you spent a significant fraction of your budget on transporting attendees (you might do so for a guest of honor, and you might give free admission to people who volunteer at a certain level). We have the weigh the benefit of increasing attendance by a few more people vs the cost, and whether they are the ones who are working to "finish BPFK, create a dictionary, update the reference materials, and launch Lojban learning software on the web". I supported Robin's idea of an award for a significant contribution to the machine grammar, but we are now talking about spending equivalent "awards" for individuals merely to attend LogFest. Again, I can buy this to a limited extent, but I obviously prefer a lower limit. At this point, I can accept Arnt's proposal, but I think we need to do some seriously long term thinking about how much money we want to raise, and what we want to be spending it on. And I'd love for us to get to the point where we WANT to expand more rapidly than word-of-mouth offers. lojbab