From arj@nvg.ntnu.no Tue Oct 06 12:38:19 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list llg-board); Tue, 06 Oct 2009 12:38:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sabre-wulf.nvg.ntnu.no ([129.241.210.67]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MvFrQ-0000hi-Ix for llg-board@lojban.org; Tue, 06 Oct 2009 12:38:18 -0700 Received: from hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no (unknown [IPv6:2001:700:300:2000:2a0:c9ff:feab:76e2]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by sabre-wulf.nvg.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BFDE94781; Tue, 6 Oct 2009 21:37:46 +0200 (CEST) Received: from hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no (8.13.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id n96JbfdM015879; Tue, 6 Oct 2009 21:37:41 +0200 Received: (from arj@localhost) by hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no (8.13.8/8.13.1/Submit) id n96JbYrN015875; Tue, 6 Oct 2009 21:37:34 +0200 Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2009 21:37:34 +0200 From: Arnt Richard Johansen To: llg-board@lojban.org Cc: John Cowan Subject: [llg-board] Re: "Community edited version" of CLL uploaded to the wiki Message-ID: <20091006193734.GL3835@nvg.org> References: <20091004134024.GA3835@nvg.org> <4AC8C7F4.4060002@lojban.org> <20091004170556.GC3835@nvg.org> <20091004172217.GD3835@nvg.org> <20091004193709.GA21532@mercury.ccil.org> <4AC9825E.5070703@lojban.org> <20091005222157.GI18623@mercury.ccil.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20091005222157.GI18623@mercury.ccil.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-NVG-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-NVG-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: arj@nvg.ntnu.no X-archive-position: 581 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: llg-board-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: arj@nvg.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: llg-board@lojban.org X-list: llg-board On Mon, Oct 05, 2009 at 06:21:57PM -0400, John Cowan wrote: > The community edition uses a corrected version of the posted > chapter-by-chapter HTML format as the editable master. It can be > edited with any HTML editor or by hand with equal ease, and its format > is standardized by W3C and ISO. That is a good point. I'm still angry because they (for it now seems that it is a group effort, and that remod may not even be the one spearheading it) started merging the errata without asking for permission, distributed the updated CLL without asking for permission, and persist in not asking for permission, even after being told both by Robin and myself that that is what they need to do. But I agree with Matt that we need to think about what's good for the language and what's good for the reputation of the LLG. So I propose that we take the following actions: 1) Have the copyright of the CE assigned to us. I don't know if the changes that have been made are actually copyrightable, but if they are, and it doesn't belong to us, we do not have the legal right to do any of the following: 2) Grant permission to distribute the CED under the same licence as any other CLL. 3) Save the CE for use as the basis of the future 2nd ed. of CLL. (I share Bob's concern that substantive changes in the language may have been inserted, either accidentally or maliciously. But I'm convinced that public scrutiny will reveal any such changes, and in any case, the book carries a note that it is not the real thing.) To take care of 1), we should begin by making a reasonable effort to contact everyone involved with the project. -- Arnt Richard Johansen http://arj.nvg.org/ Your speaker should [...] not be suffering for a cold, or cough, or a hangover. If something goes wrong [...] it is important that the speaker has as similar a voice as with the original recording, waiting for another cold to come along is not reasonable, (though some may argue that the same hangover can easily be induced). --Building Synthetic Voices, by Alan W. Black and Kevin A. Lenzo