Received: from localhost ([::1]:45321 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aryoh-0007mW-7E; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:35 -0700 Received: from mail-vk0-f46.google.com ([209.85.213.46]:33691) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aryoZ-0007mP-Gq for llg-members@lojban.org; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:31 -0700 Received: by mail-vk0-f46.google.com with SMTP id n62so89190420vkb.0 for ; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to; bh=+liDl6EP/SXv+BqGAPg7e65Rm6m5iT9uNm0QGRVmuXA=; b=nuZgfZAPTkysNRONp6ipDaARBy5OzpPIYL+sl9cUla1Y4VlOys85pdgktPFIMsBQ0/ C0qxt7cW34hoEGxmY3pUCfjFdpdaGrYqAHNYjNTcverdxSfta9iilgXLaVtKBge+Xy8G csNYa0OVXf3vg/SpfS7EffOraTUhJqIhCu6Tl4MyLAvtUSo5I4dJ5Gs5HGzPvWS2VrF/ tf+FZ9vwZX7biuCalVbgXOakX/Wd4/h/bgTrOTCFXFXBjohB+vVw/XIt9A+YuX4kHhDk AxPrWH2wfBimRYKXQx2Zt5n+PuApRXxBIwgxd1fwWIZ/8BJ1ZaNy5WRMrynqSveePctV Sx6g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to; bh=+liDl6EP/SXv+BqGAPg7e65Rm6m5iT9uNm0QGRVmuXA=; b=g/MJYPptF4HphYYohrjgN7sWXiOds1y4fypZNJBrVRawGtVCpMohcrWi8f6OA4wOjP Yc/51IphXMrujZRONzvqIXaSXSfG24fEwN1/EfIRLtX197Hlx9LrPHG/Ap6PUhNVufXI W0MnnsFwxaX2kYVWfAdL+mAQ6HoZwS1V5xzSs4CKxshfL7CfdmWoAdNJNc9+aLZDzPzw CR6bhgN6Njdos3KICkFsgXSPBzzyrJU66LTrZPnlSUq3+x/EPA2jcYonPbKDbEX3sUNW JMlaf6PL/WsSxfawFiV5OMzc29w8kYgS+ME96cFsCORiHtxikB3xy/1JxPdnBGf9TJLk DGPQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOPr4FXCdBOVBnqQnLm95nTFYjIObp8bc2P8250igDzlR0w88XI/NWldpUuF1gV6GKjxBtZ/vekYda3N+6zFng== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.31.41.195 with SMTP id p186mr15262488vkp.20.1460946081168; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.176.66.226 with HTTP; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.176.66.226 with HTTP; Sun, 17 Apr 2016 19:21:20 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <571271C9.7050002@lojban.org> <50A08C82-B160-4ADB-B5D9-D2FBB307C32E@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2016 22:21:20 -0400 Message-ID: From: Curtis Franks To: llg-members@lojban.org X-Spam-Score: -2.0 (--) X-Spam_score: -2.0 X-Spam_score_int: -19 X-Spam_bar: -- Subject: Re: [Llg-members] Annual meeting: New Business, anyone? X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5799917657501463440==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============5799917657501463440== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a113ee81834440e0530b90421 --001a113ee81834440e0530b90421 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I think (note: not move) that: from time to time, the Logical Language Group (LLG) membership xor the Governing Board thereof when the former has not done so but doing so is deemed necessary in the near future or present by the latter, shall establish or restore the membership of a standing committee, hereby called the Logical Language Group Web Pages Enforcement Committee (LLGWPEC), which shall review all changes made to the Logical Language Group Web Page (LLGWP) performed in the interim since the last such review and ensure their compliance with any pertinent rules established by those aforementioned groups in official capacity. The cardinality of the membership to the LLGWPEC shall be an odd number no less than three whensoever it is established and shall be restored to the value that it had when it was last established as soon as possible. Its membership is drawn from the set of members of the LLG (or its Governing Board when necessary) and BPFK, voting or otherwise, having at least one member from each body (although these members may belong to both), and the appointment, reinstatement, or removal of an individual from the LLGWPEC shall be governed by a simple majority approval by vote of the LLG. Expiration of membership from all of these bodies necessitates immediate expulsion from the LLGWPEC. In any case, the membership of the LLGWPEC should be, on an individual basis, reveiwed and put to a vote for reinstatement at least once every two years, as prescribed elsewhere (which we should do). This committee has the power to recommend changes to the laws concerning the LLGWP, but has no power to establish new such laws; it can and must enforce only compliance with laws already established by the LLG or its Governing Board or some body vested with such powers by these bodies as prescribed elsewhere. If an infraction is found in the opinion of a simple majority of the membership of the LLGWPEC, the infraction is to be reported to the LLG or its Governing Board immediately; any other action is to be prohibited except as prescribed elsewhere (which we should establish). Any alleged infraction to which the LLG or its Governing Board is alerted by the LLGWPEC is to be reviewed as soon as possible and that reviewing body may conclude, as it desires, precedentially or otherwise, on a judgment as to the validity of the allegation of infraction and a course of action pertaining to the alleged infraction (in any case), by a simple majority vote. The reviewing body may order the LLGWPEC to rectify or alter the situation pertaining to any aspect of the LLGWP, including any alleged infractions, at any time, immediately whereupon the LLGWPEC is to comply and adjust the situation exactly according to specifications and instructions issued to it; the LLGWPEC has the exactly the power necessary to make these adjustments to the LLGWP according exactly to any orders which it receives from such a reviewing body, under the auspices of the LLG, but nothing else or more, these powers expiring immediately upon completion of these tasks. The reviewing bodies may affect changes to the LLGWP via other means as well. On Apr 17, 2016 9:35 PM, "Curtis Franks" wrote: > (See below) > > On Apr 17, 2016 21:31, "Craig Daniel" wrote: > > > > I second la .karis.'s motion, and apologize for not being immediately > responsive to this thread. > > > > I am in the middle of a seven-game home stand, and I'll be out of town > on business when it ends, so I don't believe I'm likely to be any more so > until next week. In the interests of fast processes, I hereby give my proxy > to la .karis., effective from just after this message until 23:59 EDT on > April 26. > > > > For the sake of procedure being ensured to reflect membership > intentions, I second the motion to adjourn, but cast my vote on the > procedural point this immediately triggers as .ienai / Nay. > > > > - mi'e .kreig. > > > > As there is some discussion taking place at the moment, I too vote against > the motion to adjourn. > > > > > On Sun, Apr 17, 2016, 9:20 PM Karen Stein wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I would like to first respond to Guskant's comments, as follows : > >> > >> > >> >As Bob could not identify the motion among my complaints, maybe I had > >> >better make clear to the secretary what to record in the minutes. I > >> >herewith make a summary of the motion I raised: > >> > > >> >1. making a response to the open letter > >> >http://guskant.github.io/lojbo/open_letter/ > >> >; > >> > > >> >2. putting the official website under control of LLG and creating the > >> >website policies; > >> > > >> >3. depriving Gleki of his administratorship on the official website > >> >(as written in the open letter, not only the mediawiki engine but > >> >also any tools on Vrici server); > >> > > >> >4. asserting on the official website that the official body does not > >> >have any account of Twitter, or reporting the abuse of > >> >official-pretending account to Twitter. > >> > > >> > >> > >> I specifically want to comment on point number 2. I fully agree with > this, therefore... > >> > >> I move that full control over the official web pages known as the > Logical Language Group Web Page be placed under the jurisdiction of the > official membership of said group, also known as LLG. This body will > designate who does and who does not have authority to make changes to these > pages. Decisions of the Logical Language Group Board will be considered as > decisions of said membership when the membership has not made such > determination and the board determines that such a decision cannot wait for > the next scheduled membership meeting. > >> > >> karis > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Llg-members mailing list > >> Llg-members@lojban.org > >> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Llg-members mailing list > > Llg-members@lojban.org > > http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members > > > --001a113ee81834440e0530b90421 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think (note: not move) that: from time to time, the Logica= l Language Group (LLG) membership xor the Governing Board thereof when the = former has not done so but doing so is deemed necessary in the near future = or present by the latter, shall establish or restore the membership of a st= anding committee, hereby called the Logical Language Group Web Pages Enforc= ement Committee (LLGWPEC), which shall review all changes made to the Logic= al Language Group Web Page (LLGWP) performed in the interim since the last = such review and ensure their compliance with any pertinent rules establishe= d by those aforementioned groups in official capacity. The cardinality of t= he membership to the LLGWPEC shall be an odd number no less than three when= soever it is established and shall be restored to the value that it had whe= n it was last established as soon as possible. Its membership is drawn from= the set of members of the LLG (or its Governing Board when necessary) and = BPFK, voting or otherwise, having at least one member from each body (altho= ugh these members may belong to both), and the appointment, reinstatement, = or removal of an individual from the LLGWPEC shall be governed by a simple = majority approval by vote of the LLG. Expiration of membership from all of = these bodies necessitates immediate expulsion from the LLGWPEC. In any case= , the membership of the LLGWPEC should be, on an individual basis, reveiwed= and put to a vote for reinstatement at least once every two years, as pres= cribed elsewhere (which we should do). This committee has the power to reco= mmend changes to the laws concerning the LLGWP, but has no power to establi= sh new such laws; it can and must enforce only compliance with laws already= established by the LLG or its Governing Board or some body vested with suc= h powers by these bodies as prescribed elsewhere. If an infraction is found= in the opinion of a simple majority of the membership of the LLGWPEC, the = infraction is to be reported to the LLG or its Governing Board immediately;= any other action is to be prohibited except as prescribed elsewhere (which= we should establish). Any alleged infraction to which the LLG or its Gover= ning Board is alerted by the LLGWPEC is to be reviewed as soon as possible = and that reviewing body may conclude, as it desires, precedentially or othe= rwise, on a judgment as to the validity of the allegation of infraction and= a course of action pertaining to the alleged infraction (in any case), by = a simple majority vote. The reviewing body may order the LLGWPEC to rectify= or alter the situation pertaining to any aspect of the LLGWP, including an= y alleged infractions, at any time, immediately whereupon the LLGWPEC is to= comply and adjust the situation exactly according to specifications and in= structions issued to it; the LLGWPEC has the exactly the power necessary to= make these adjustments to the LLGWP according exactly to any orders which = it receives from such a reviewing body, under the auspices of the LLG, but = nothing else or more, these powers expiring immediately upon completion of = these tasks. The reviewing bodies may affect changes to the LLGWP via other= means as well.

On Apr 17, 2016 9:35 PM, "Curtis Franks&quo= t; <curtis.w.franks@gmail.c= om> wrote:
(See below)

On Apr 17, 2016 21:31, "Craig Daniel" <craigbdaniel@gmail.com= > wrote:
>
> I second la .karis.'s motion, and apologize for not being immediat= ely responsive to this thread.
>
> I am in the middle of a seven-game home stand, and I'll be out of = town on business when it ends, so I don't believe I'm likely to be = any more so until next week. In the interests of fast processes, I hereby g= ive my proxy to la .karis., effective from just after this message until 23= :59 EDT on April 26.
>
> For the sake of procedure being ensured to reflect membership intentio= ns, I second the motion to adjourn, but cast my vote on the procedural poin= t this immediately triggers as .ienai / Nay.
>
> - mi'e .kreig.
>

As there is some discussion taking place at the moment, I to= o vote against the motion to adjourn.

>
> On Sun, Apr 17, 2016, 9:20 PM Karen Stein <comcaresvcs@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> I would like to first respond to Guskant's comments, as follow= s :
>>
>> <snip >
>> >As Bob could not identify the motion among my complaints, mayb= e I had
>> >better make clear to the secretary what to record in the minut= es. I
>> >herewith make a summary of the motion I raised:
>> >
>> >1. making a response to the open letter
>> >http://guskant.github.io/lojbo/open_letter/
>> >;
>> >
>> >2. putting the official website under control of LLG and creat= ing the
>> >website policies;
>> >
>> >3. depriving Gleki of his administratorship on the official we= bsite
>> >(as=C2=A0 written in the open letter, not only the mediawiki e= ngine but
>> >also any tools on Vrici server);
>> >
>> >4. asserting on the official website that the official body do= es not
>> >have any account of Twitter, or reporting the abuse of
>> >official-pretending account to Twitter.
>> >
>> <snip>
>>
>> I specifically want to comment on point number 2. I fully agree wi= th this, therefore...
>>
>> I move that full control over the official web pages known as the = Logical Language Group Web Page be placed under the jurisdiction of the off= icial membership of said group, also known as LLG. This body will designate= who does and who does not have authority to make changes to these pages. D= ecisions of the Logical Language Group Board will be considered as decision= s of said membership when the membership has not made such determination an= d the board determines that such a decision cannot wait for the next schedu= led membership meeting.
>>
>> karis
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Llg-members mailing list
>> Llg-me= mbers@lojban.org
>> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Llg-members mailing list
> Llg-member= s@lojban.org
> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members
>

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