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([2601:5c0:c000:5293:45e:8d83:8c7e:f279]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j20sm9354519qke.42.2017.04.22.14.19.35 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 22 Apr 2017 14:19:35 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2017 17:19:28 -0400 In-Reply-To: <0457f7fe-dfd2-2ef6-9402-00d1dd15b239@lojban.org> References: <0457f7fe-dfd2-2ef6-9402-00d1dd15b239@lojban.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 To: llg-members@lojban.org From: Karen Stein Message-ID: <19AE0EBA-AD2B-46BA-A03D-F2E77F52D7A8@gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: -1.5 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.5 X-Spam_score_int: -14 X-Spam_bar: - Subject: Re: [Llg-members] Request for clarification X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2209626135533737625==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============2209626135533737625== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----PKAEBQ9X4VOMAWBUV3WIOZIK3A6P4T" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------PKAEBQ9X4VOMAWBUV3WIOZIK3A6P4T Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lojbab's belief that discussion between meetings occur here is not what I u= nderstood the proposal to be=2E My understanding was that discussion was go= ing to happen at random times using any and all the discussion methods avai= lable to at least some members of the broad lojban community=2E=20 Since there is such a difference between these two I did have one item of = business to address at this time=2E I would like to have this clarified=2E = We all need to know before we adjourn what the procedures we are using for = our trial such as the means with which everyone is to be notified of topics= , and when and where such discussions will be happening=2E If it is to be t= otally freeform, please make this clear=2E =2Ekaris=2E On April 22, 2017 2:39:03 PM EDT, Bob LeChevalier wr= ote: >On 4/20/2017 8:03 PM, guskant wrote: >> 2017-04-13 20:31 GMT+00:00 Bob LeChevalier : >>> I'll allow a full week for responses, until end of day 21 April=2E If >there >>> are motions that need to be decided, they need a second, and then >you may >>> proceed to debate without me explicitly calling for it=2E I will try >to pay >>> attention in order to keep things moving=2E If there are no motions >by then, >>> we should adjourn=2E >> >> We have a motion that was implicitly seconded by Gleki=2E >> The motion is entitled "Motion: liberate lojban=2Eorg to community >> volunteers, and move the official contents to another website", and >> archived here: >> >http://mail=2Elojban=2Eorg/mailman/private/llg-members/2017-February/0013= 57=2Ehtml >> >> A reply of Gleki in the following part of discussion implies that he >> seconded the motion=2E >> >> 2017-02-20 14:38 GMT+00:00 guskant : >>> 2017-02-20 11:14 GMT+00:00 Gleki Arxokuna >: >>>> Using github=2Ecom for official repositories can be dangerous since >Github is >>>> not own by LLG=2E >>>> I suggest >>>> 1=2E still use Github >>>> 2=2E make synced backups of all official repositories on Github at >servers >>>> owned by LLG or provided to LLG for free=2E >>> >>> So you agree to the optional suggestion that requires the motion >being >>> realized=2E It implies that you agree to the motion=2E Say "I second!" >>> I hope this motion makes you really {gleki} because you will become >>> not being blamed for your abuse of power on the "official" website=2E >>> >> >> I guess you all want to adjourn the meeting as soon as possible >> without discussing any important matter, and I give up discussion >> until the meeting of 2017=2E > >I think we indeed want to get the meeting adjourned (separate message=20 >coming)=2E But as I understand the concept that mukti has advanced, the= =20 >discussion should primarily take place OUTSIDE the meeting, in advance=20 >of a formal decision at a meeting=2E > >Once the 2016 meeting ends, this mailing list still exists with all=20 >voting members enrolled=2E So people can and should be talking up their= =20 >ideas for community action (the regular Lojban list, as well as the IRC > >Lojban channel(s) also exist for such discussion)=2E > >This discussion can be tied to a specific proposal, such as the=20 >paragraphs that you quoted above, or it can be less restricted, with >the=20 >goal of producing a motion that will be formally voted on at the next=20 >(2017) annual meeting=2E mukti will call for motions IN ADVANCE of that= =20 >annual meeting, and those motions presented in advance will constitute=20 >the agenda for the meeting=2E The meeting then moves along at a much=20 >faster speed, because most/all of the discussion has taken place before > >the meeting=2E I believe that one or more planned IRC sessions also fit= =20 >into the proposal as well=2E > >If discussion produces a consensus and speed is desired, that consensus > >can be passed to the Board of directors which can approve most ideas at > >any time of the year, and that also will reduce the time required for=20 >the formal annual meeting=2E > >mukti and others should feel free to correct my interpretation of the=20 >concept=2E > >lojbab > > >_______________________________________________ >Llg-members mailing list >Llg-members@lojban=2Eorg >http://mail=2Elojban=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/llg-members ------PKAEBQ9X4VOMAWBUV3WIOZIK3A6P4T Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lojbab's belief that discussion between meetin= gs occur here is not what I understood the proposal to be=2E My understandi= ng was that discussion was going to happen at random times using any and al= l the discussion methods available to at least some members of the broad lo= jban community=2E

Since there is such a difference between these two I did have one item of = business to address at this time=2E I would like to have this clarified=2E = We all need to know before we adjourn what the procedures we are using for = our trial such as the means with which everyone is to be notified of topics= , and when and where such discussions will be happening=2E If it is to be t= otally freeform, please make this clear=2E

=2Ekaris=2E

On April 22, 2017 2:39:03 PM= EDT, Bob LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban=2Eorg> wrote:
On 4/20/2017 8:03 PM, guskant wrote:
 2017-04-13 20:31 GMT+00:00 Bob LeCh=
evalier <lojbab@lojban=2Eorg>:
 I'll allow a full week for responses, until end of day 21 =
April=2E  If there
 are motions that need to be decided, they need a s=
econd, and then you may
 proceed to debate without me explicitly calli=
ng for it=2E  I will try to pay
 attention in order to keep things mov=
ing=2E  If there are no motions by then,
 we should adjourn=2E

 We have a motion that was implicitly seconded by Gleki=2E=

 The motion is entitled "Motion: liberate lojban=2Eorg to community
 volunteers, and move the offi=
cial contents to another website", and
 archived here:
 http://mail=2Elojban=2Eorg/mailman/private/llg-members/2017=
-February/001357=2Ehtml

 A reply of Gleki in the following p=
art of discussion implies that he
 seconded the motion=2E

 =
2017-02-20 14:38 GMT+00:00 guskant <gusni=2Ekantu@gmail=2Ecom>:
=

 2017-02-20 11:14 GMT+00:0=
0 Gleki Arxokuna <gleki=2Eis=
=2Emy=2Ename@gmail=2Ecom>:
 Using github=2Ecom for of=
ficial repositories can be dangerous since Github is
 not own by LLG=
=2E
 I suggest
 1=2E still use Github
 2=2E make synced back=
ups of all official repositories on Github at servers
 owned by LLG or=
 provided to LLG for free=2E

 So you agree to the o=
ptional suggestion that requires the motion being
 realized=2E It impl=
ies that you agree to the motion=2E Say "I second!"
 I hope =
this motion makes you really {gleki} because you will become
 not bein=
g blamed for your abuse of power on the "official" website=2E

 I guess you all want to adjourn the meeting as soon a=
s possible
 without discussing any important matter, and I give up dis=
cussion
 until the meeting of 2017=2E

I think =
we indeed want to get the meeting adjourned (separate message 
coming)=
=2E  But as I understand the concept that mukti has advanced, the 
dis=
cussion should primarily take place OUTSIDE the meeting, in advance 
o=
f a formal decision at a meeting=2E

Once the 2016 meeting ends, =
this mailing list still exists with all 
voting members enrolled=2E  S=
o people can and should be talking up their 
ideas for community actio=
n (the regular Lojban list, as well as the IRC 
Lojban channel(s) also=
 exist for such discussion)=2E

This discussion can be tied to a =
specific proposal, such as the 
paragraphs that you quoted above, or i=
t can be less restricted, with the 
goal of producing a motion that wi=
ll be formally voted on at the next 
(2017) annual meeting=2E  mukti w=
ill call for motions IN ADVANCE of that 
annual meeting, and those mot=
ions presented in advance will constitute 
the agenda for the meeting=
=2E  The meeting then moves along at a much 
faster speed, because mos=
t/all of the discussion has taken place before 
the meeting=2E  I beli=
eve that one or more planned IRC sessions also fit 
into the proposal =
as well=2E

If discussion produces a consensus and speed is desir=
ed, that consensus 
can be passed to the Board of directors which can =
approve most ideas at 
any time of the year, and that also will reduce=
 the time required for 
the formal annual meeting=2E

mukti =
and others should feel free to correct my interpretation of the 
conce=
pt=2E

lojbab



Llg-members mailing li=
st
Llg-members@lojban=2Eorg
http://mail=2Elojban=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/=
llg-members
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