Received: from localhost ([::1]:43032 helo=stodi.digitalkingdom.org) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1eYcq2-000875-Eu; Mon, 08 Jan 2018 11:12:02 -0800 Received: from mail-oi0-f48.google.com ([209.85.218.48]:36639) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1eYcpV-00085M-AA for llg-members@lojban.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2018 11:11:30 -0800 Received: by mail-oi0-f48.google.com with SMTP id j14so8085112oih.3 for ; Mon, 08 Jan 2018 11:11:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=j6E9ynJOFXpp4veZTKRNW2ntcA4kh5tv7+7iLhxKtCE=; b=J9ghxcaQBtiLnSGEskpWjqQh5U5Cw7etUtad/LPkGTA3Sebp8R2Ds5udVOTVZrygkc 6W7Mrg/cBl2UbSi+hzaER+vVFNVTFGtWWoy9B5eG4agpv1voTwogmuH77iuYvlCidR9Z u50d0Q7aeLUzbhXVk89kfWkyBV2WVdQnmgXtKplniAME3rPZHvDoJ15HBvKMqKZuhZad i2QR9RcgaLcm0pti1so6Eedj4zomovaVAFA0UXnm1IrjfWlRtOzF5GnDxZX6mAT4f7gB MfLJbFaHOWBGbvtIzO15Y64J31WwSlXuipn0Z1X81bhnIwMfGjtjysbvm/HAWsZMZrKQ o6vw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=j6E9ynJOFXpp4veZTKRNW2ntcA4kh5tv7+7iLhxKtCE=; b=ApHR5FfxTFxADjVS2LFj9dn5fSy8IRe7K7UfiRZgNYn+bQ6/0h0n5I4Z66d1nMGx1i hvWjrQSvSdipAENOMT3mh4igoTKtR2yuo6XY7jUnLmV83av26DSGjp4myofk9aaxIC3j MxQD8rVkkZy0XYhe0GfdkdkJH8961YpFM+UUXrqLFJYFXQgn6ysGDSsO/xPGAbqGDjt+ nXy8/roPi9rPe/A33AgmGbhAfgcDDzTzlLBhLDthE0knWgXWYGjt7JDjjThumGnN9lZm NQCzCatjQM//odvtnBGn9PKcVHoqYxm1ufYoWK9qbylskJaiWLzk1et/TZQI4brBCy9O oJGw== X-Gm-Message-State: AKwxytcy+mJEcaN/LHEa7G0arxZtrfxk2plBmjd79M4XGctdZ5N/oqCa 3+P+FCUofwDUeqvcJtVqKjf5enoTUZbp5mMKZX0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACJfBotRoAgvJG+PaYKsHhxRHtAL0+gm02095OvG+H957ce9GeOqvPbfNfXeXJ5mzV3Tqch6fU6jPcF6pozbXKWRDbs= X-Received: by 10.202.252.17 with SMTP id a17mr6573436oii.319.1515438682380; Mon, 08 Jan 2018 11:11:22 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <61CCB92E-11C6-4F17-9A63-AF3519E8416D@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <61CCB92E-11C6-4F17-9A63-AF3519E8416D@gmail.com> From: Adam Lopresto Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2018 19:11:11 +0000 Message-ID: To: llg-members@lojban.org X-Spam-Score: -4.3 (----) X-Spam_score: -4.3 X-Spam_score_int: -42 X-Spam_bar: ---- Subject: Re: [Llg-members] Proposal : Investigation of Unofficialness X-BeenThere: llg-members@lojban.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: llg-members@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============8724655139272979141==" Errors-To: llg-members-bounces@lojban.org --===============8724655139272979141== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a113b1be8579e7c0562489087" --001a113b1be8579e7c0562489087 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you. I've been trying to come up with how to express my problems with the motions, and you put it far better than I could. I agree wholeheartedly= . For the record, I'm voting "Nay" on motion 4, motion 5 (as it stands now), motion 6, and the Ice modifications for motion 6. On Fri, Jan 5, 2018 at 1:31 PM Riley Martinez-Lynch wrote: > I would support a motion like #5 which requires a disclaimer on lojban.or= g > content that might be easily confused as an official publication of LLG. > However, I think we should consider this alongside the option of reservin= g > lojban.org for official publications of LLG. > > I strongly oppose a commission to "search for and monitor=E2=80=9D (motio= n 4) > others=E2=80=99 publications for lojban-related content with the purpose = of asking > them to add a disclaimer to their content. Even if we had the resources t= o > squander =E2=80=94 and we don=E2=80=99t =E2=80=94 it would reflect badly = on lojban and the LLG. > > Imagine: Someone discovers lojban, composes a poem, and puts it up on > their blog. The next thing they know, they receive a legalistically-worde= d > email asking them to =E2=80=9Cprominently=E2=80=9D declare that, in effec= t, they=E2=80=99re not > really authorized to use the language. This is not who we are. > > I am categorically opposed to motion 6, which would create some kind of > body to "oversee,=E2=80=8B regulate=E2=80=8B, and (insofar as possible) e= nforce=E2=80=9D these > policies. It is not and cannot be the business of LLG to scour the world > for =E2=80=9Cviolations=E2=80=9D of our policies, let alone =E2=80=9Cenfo= rce=E2=80=9D such policies. For > that matter, =E2=80=9Coversee=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cregulate=E2=80=9D don= =E2=80=99t harmonize with our mission, > either: Our business is to =E2=80=9Cpromote=E2=80=9D and to =E2=80=9Csupp= ort=E2=80=9D =E2=80=94 especially where it > comes to those =E2=80=9Cusing=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cexperimenting=E2=80= =9D with lojban. > > Lojban, as I understand it, was born out of the desire to rescue logical > language from institutional strangulation. Let us not reverse course. > > On Jan 5, 2018, at 1:00 PM, Curtis Franks > wrote: > > The basic goal of this motion is to outsource all particular debate and > decisions concerning the realization of Motion 4 or Motion 5 to an > independent 'contracting' body with a fair amount of autonomy so that we = do > not have to consider them here (or prior to the passage of those motions)= . > However, I still want the contracting body to be finite in power (hence i= ts > restrictions and preset expiration), accountable to us, well-organized so > that objections or concerns raised by members while discussing Motion 6 a= re > pre=C3=ABmptively assuaged, and acting on our behalf with the additional > property that all of their work becomes LLG policy, property, etc. once t= he > contract ends (thus it would be under LLG control and carry the weight of > full policy, work, command, etc. of the LLG pursuant to Motion 4 or Motio= n > 5 or other motions). > > On Jan 5, 2018 09:51, "Creative Care Services" > wrote: > > In addition to the two other proposals regarding unofficial content, >> included below because this one refers to them, Curtis pointed out that = he >> had made three rather than two on this topic. The one we are considering >> here is listed below as number six. >> >> This motion is now waiting to see if anyone chooses to second it. >> >> .karis. >> >> >>> *Concerning Unofficial Social Media Presences* >>> >>> *Motion 4: "*The LLG shall adopt an official policy that the LLG or >>> some body constituted by it for such purpose shall search for and monit= or >>> social media or blog platforms, accounts, pages, profiles, groups, >>> communities, bots, etc. (hereafter called "entities") which in any way >>> whatsoever relate to, promote, or use Lojban or other LLG-adopted logic= al >>> languages and which are not clearly human, personal, non-promoting, or >>> unofficial - and that such a body shall request such entities to >>> prominently display a disclaimer stating that they are unofficial and n= ot >>> endorsed by the LLG.*"* >>> * * I noted the following caveat with the original discussion which >>> became a motion: "(I do not think that we can enforce such requests, ju= st >>> make them. But having an official policy about addressing them may be g= ood >>> and gives us some moral 'standing')"* >>> * * Moved by me, seconded by gleki.* >>> >>> *___* >>> >>> *Unofficialness Disclaimer* >>> >>> *Motion 5: "*All non-official pages or content on *.lojban.org must >>> contain a disclaimer stating, at least, that the website is owned and >>> managed by voluntary people, and that the marked contents are not >>> necessarily harmonized with the official design of Lojban and may not >>> reflect, let alone perfectly comply with, official specifications of th= e >>> same.*"* >>> ** Moved by me, seconded by at least guskant and gleki.* >>> >>> >> >> >> **** Here it is! **** >> >> >> *Motion 6: "*There shall be =E2=80=8Bauthorized, =E2=80=8Bestablished=E2= =80=8B, constituted,=E2=80=8B >>> and organized a body=E2=80=8B - under and by the authority of the LLG -= =E2=80=8B which >>> will=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B the official implementation and application of L= LG policy consistent >>> with and pursuant to the content of the aforementioned motion proposals= *(id >>> est: Motion 4 or Motion 5)*, provided the passage of at least one >>> thereof,=E2=80=8B or any similar policy of the LLG=E2=80=8B and which s= hall search for >>> either potential violations of the same or appropriate content which sh= ould >>> be so disclaimed (regardless of any implemented policy or other mandate= , >>> and not pertaining to only websites or entities or content subject to t= he >>> aforementioned policies of the LLG); when it finds such content but doe= s >>> not have the authority to pursue such disclaimer with respect to said >>> content, it shall notify the LLG of the situation and its recommendatio= ns >>> pertaining to such=E2=80=8B; =E2=80=8Bthis motion shall be inactive, va= cuous, and=E2=80=8B totally=E2=80=8B >>> ignored if the aforementioned motion proposals *(Motion 4, Motion 5)* b= oth >>> do not pass.=E2=80=8B =E2=80=8BAll of this body's authority shall be in= ferior to and >>> subsumed by that of the LLG and shall be bounded by such policy of the = LLG >>> and it shall not notify or attempt to regulate any entity or content wh= ich >>> is not subject to or the subject of such LLG policy, although it may se= arch >>> for and review such content.=E2=80=8B It will regulate the officially= =E2=80=8B-=E2=80=8Bdesired >>> design, implementation, usage=E2=80=8B, and enforcement =E2=80=8Bof any= such notice, >>> protocol, or disclaimer=E2=80=8B in the stead of the LLG directly=E2=80= =8B. The body shall >>> consist of an odd number of members, numbering at least five. The body >>> shall publish all of its =E2=80=8Bdebate, =E2=80=8Bdecision=E2=80=8B=E2= =80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bs=E2=80=8B, =E2=80=8Band work to the LLG and >>> will notify the pertinent websites and entities and other subjects, >>> according to its own discretion or explicit and direct command by the L= LG, >>> as to its standards and policies once such are concretely established= =E2=80=8B. >>> Whilst the body is constituted, the LLG=E2=80=8B shall retain total rig= ht of >>> oversight and control over, but not necessarily responsibility for, the >>> body and any of its ouput=E2=80=8B or decisions or actions or methods o= r works, as >>> well as any matter belonging to its domain of purpose=E2=80=8B or its p= urview; the >>> body shall govern and organize itself and design and enforce its own >>> internal rules, its external standards, etc. =E2=80=8Binsofar as such d= oes not >>> conflict with the decisions of the LLG=E2=80=8B, including the contents= of this >>> motion=E2=80=8B. The body shall be composed on the earliest of=E2=80=8B= =E2=80=8B the first 1 >>> January or first 1 June after its first membership is chosen, after whi= ch >>> point it shall exist for =E2=80=8Bfully =E2=80=8Bfour =E2=80=8Bcalendri= cal =E2=80=8Byears and six >>> =E2=80=8Bcalendrical =E2=80=8Bmonths and then =E2=80=8Bshall =E2=80=8Bb= e dissolved=E2=80=8B, disconstituted,=E2=80=8B and >>> discontinued in its entirety, unless its lifetime is extended=E2=80=8B = and such >>> expiration is delayed in part or whole by explicit=E2=80=8B official ac= tion of the >>> LLG; upon it=E2=80=8Bs expiration=E2=80=8B (described previously)=E2=80= =8B, all of its =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bpolicy, >>> standards, work, decisions, and other output shall devolve to=E2=80=8B = and become >>> the direct responsibility of=E2=80=8B the LLG and shall persist and rem= ain active >>> and valid =E2=80=8Bas =E2=80=8Bpolicy, standards, work, decisions, and = other output=E2=80=8B (as >>> appropriate) of and in the responsibility of the LLG=E2=80=8B until the= LLG=E2=80=8B >>> explicitly decides otherwise=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B or upon the est= ablishment and constitution >>> of another body or organization under the authority of the LLG which ha= s or >>> shall have purview which nonemptily intersects that of the body herein >>> described (in which case, all aforementioned pertinent =E2=80=8Bpolicy,= standards, >>> work, decisions, and other output=E2=80=8B =E2=80=8Bshall be inherited = by and devolved to >>> it unless otherwise specified by the LLG); the =E2=80=8Bfirst =E2=80=8B= membership of the >>> body =E2=80=8Bherein constituted =E2=80=8Bshall be =E2=80=8Bselected in= a manner which the LLG >>> decides =E2=80=8Bto be appropriate, which shall be determined later=E2= =80=8B by the LLG; >>> thereafter, all other selection and regulation of its membership shall = be >>> under the primary authority and review of the body itself, although any >>> regular selection of new membership shall not occur prior to the elapse= of >>> fully two calendrical years and six calendrical months after the origin= al >>> establishment of the body=E2=80=8B and selection of its first membershi= p; all >>> membership applications and notice for such application shall be public= ; >>> eligibility requirements for membership to the body shall be subject to >>> review and change by the LLG and must be explicitly established, with >>> explicit permission of the LLG, prior to the selection of any new >>> membership of the body.=E2=80=8B The name of the body herein constitute= d shall be >>> determined by the LLG during or prior to, and as part of, the selection= of >>> its first membership.*=E2=80=8B"* >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Llg-members mailing list >> Llg-members@lojban.org >> http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members >> >> _______________________________________________ > Llg-members mailing list > Llg-members@lojban.org > http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members > > _______________________________________________ > Llg-members mailing list > Llg-members@lojban.org > http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-members > --001a113b1be8579e7c0562489087 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you. I've been trying to come up with how to exp= ress my problems with the motions, and you put it far better than I could. = I agree wholeheartedly.

For the record, I'm voting &= quot;Nay" on motion 4, motion 5 (as it stands now), motion 6, and the = Ice modifications for motion 6.

On Fri, Jan 5, 2018 at 1:31 PM Riley Martinez-Lynch <shunpiker@gmail.com> wrote:
I wou= ld support a motion like #5 which requires a disclaimer on lojban.org content that might be easily= confused as an official publication of LLG. However, I think we should con= sider this alongside the option of reserving lojban.org=C2=A0for official publications of LLG.

I strongly oppose a commission to "search for an= d monitor=E2=80=9D (motion 4) others=E2=80=99 publications for lojban-relat= ed content with the purpose of asking them to add a disclaimer to their con= tent. Even if we had the resources to squander =E2=80=94 and we don=E2=80= =99t =E2=80=94 it would reflect badly on lojban and the LLG.

=
Imagine: Someone discovers lojban, composes a poem, and puts it = up on their blog. The next thing they know, they receive a legalistically-w= orded email asking them to =E2=80=9Cprominently=E2=80=9D declare that, in e= ffect, they=E2=80=99re not really authorized to use the language. This is n= ot who we are.

I am categorically opposed to motio= n 6, which would create some kind of body to "oversee,=E2=80=8B regula= te=E2=80=8B, and (insofar as possible) enforce=E2=80=9D these policies.=C2= =A0It is not and cannot be the business of LLG to scour the world for =E2= =80=9Cviolations=E2=80=9D of our policies, let alone =E2=80=9Cenforce=E2=80= =9D such policies. For that matter, =E2=80=9Coversee=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9C= regulate=E2=80=9D don=E2=80=99t harmonize with our mission, either: Our bus= iness is to =E2=80=9Cpromote=E2=80=9D and to =E2=80=9Csupport=E2=80=9D =E2= =80=94 especially where it comes to those =E2=80=9Cusing=E2=80=9D and =E2= =80=9Cexperimenting=E2=80=9D with lojban.=C2=A0

Lo= jban, as I understand it, was born out of the desire to rescue logical lang= uage from institutional strangulation. Let us not reverse course.

On Jan 5, 2= 018, at 1:00 PM, Curtis Franks <curtis.w.franks@gmail.com> wrote:

<= /div>
The basic goal of this motion is to outsource all parti= cular debate and decisions concerning the realization of Motion 4 or Motion= 5 to an independent 'contracting' body with a fair amount of auton= omy so that we do not have to consider them here (or prior to the passage o= f those motions). However, I still want the contracting body to be finite i= n power (hence its restrictions and preset expiration), accountable to us, = well-organized so that objections or concerns raised by members while discu= ssing Motion 6 are pre=C3=ABmptively assuaged, and acting on our behalf wit= h the additional property that all of their work becomes LLG policy, proper= ty, etc. once the contract ends (thus it would be under LLG control and car= ry the weight of full policy, work, command, etc. of the LLG pursuant to Mo= tion 4 or Motion 5 or other motions).
<= div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word">
On Jan 5, 2018 09:51, &qu= ot;Creative Care Services" <comcaresvcs@gmail.com> wrote:
In addition to the = two other proposals regarding=C2=A0 unofficial content, included below beca= use this one refers to them, Curtis pointed out that he had made three rath= er than two on this topic. The one we are considering here is listed below = as number six.

This motion is now waiting to see if anyo= ne chooses to second it.=C2=A0

.karis.=C2=A0
=


=
Concerning Unofficial Social Media Prese= nces

Motion 4: "The LLG shall ado= pt an official policy that the LLG or some body constituted by it for such = purpose shall search for and monitor social media or blog platforms, accoun= ts, pages, profiles, groups, communities, bots, etc. (hereafter called &quo= t;entities") which in any way whatsoever relate to, promote, or use Lo= jban or other LLG-adopted logical languages and which are not clearly human= , personal, non-promoting, or unofficial - and that such a body shall reque= st such entities to prominently display a disclaimer stating that they are = unofficial and not endorsed by the LLG."
=C2=A0* I = noted the following caveat with the original discussion which became a moti= on: "(I do not think that we can enforce such requests, just make them= . But having an official policy about addressing them may be good and gives= us some moral 'standing')"
=C2=A0* Moved by me, se= conded by gleki.

___

Unofficialness Disclaimer
Motion 5: "All non-official pages or content on *.lojban.org=C2=A0must cont= ain a disclaimer stating, at least, that the website is owned and managed b= y voluntary people, and that the marked contents are not necessarily harmon= ized with the official design of Lojban and may not reflect, let alone perf= ectly comply with, official specifications of the same."=
* Moved by me, seconded by at least guskant and gleki.


=

=C2=A0**** Here it is! ****

<= div>
<= /div>
Motion 6: &= quot;There shall be =E2=80=8Bauthorized, =E2=80=8Bestablish= ed=E2=80=8B, constituted,=E2=80=8B and organized a body=E2=80=8B - under an= d by the authority of the LLG -=E2=80=8B which will=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B the o= fficial implementation and application of LLG policy consistent with and pu= rsuant=C2=A0to the content of the aforementioned motion proposals=C2=A0(id est: Motion 4 or Motion 5), provided the pa= ssage of at least one thereof,=E2=80=8B or any similar policy of the LLG=E2= =80=8B and which shall search for either potential violations of the same o= r appropriate content which should be so disclaimed (regardless of any impl= emented policy or other mandate, and not pertaining to only websites or ent= ities or content subject to the aforementioned policies of the LLG); when i= t finds such content but does not have the authority to pursue such disclai= mer with respect to said content, it shall notify the LLG of the situation = and its recommendations pertaining to such=E2=80=8B; =E2=80=8Bthis motion s= hall be inactive, vacuous, and=E2=80=8B totally=E2=80=8B ignored if the afo= rementioned motion proposals=C2=A0(Motion 4, Motion 5)<= span style=3D"background-color:initial;font-family:"times new roman&qu= ot;,serif">=C2=A0both do not pass.=E2=80=8B =E2=80=8BAll of this body's= authority shall be inferior to and subsumed by that of the LLG and shall b= e bounded by such policy of the LLG and it shall not notify or attempt to r= egulate any entity or content which is not subject to or the subject of suc= h LLG policy, although it may search for and review such content.=E2=80=8B = It will regulate the officially=E2=80=8B-=E2=80=8Bdesired design, implement= ation, usage=E2=80=8B, and enforcement =E2=80=8Bof any such notice, protoco= l, or disclaimer=E2=80=8B in the stead of the LLG directly=E2=80=8B. The bo= dy shall consist of an odd number of members, numbering at least five. The = body shall publish all of its =E2=80=8Bdebate, =E2=80=8Bdecision=E2=80=8B= =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bs=E2=80=8B, =E2=80=8Band work to the LLG and wil= l notify the pertinent websites and entities and other subjects, according = to its own discretion or explicit and direct command by the LLG, as to its = standards and policies once such are concretely established=E2=80=8B. Whils= t the body is constituted, the LLG=E2=80=8B shall retain total right of ove= rsight and control over, but not necessarily responsibility for, the body a= nd any of its ouput=E2=80=8B or decisions or actions or methods or works, a= s well as any matter belonging to its domain of purpose=E2=80=8B or its pur= view; the body shall govern and organize itself and design and enforce its = own internal rules, its external standards, etc. =E2=80=8Binsofar as such d= oes not conflict with the decisions of the LLG=E2=80=8B, including the cont= ents of this motion=E2=80=8B. The body shall be composed on the earliest of= =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B the first 1 January or first 1 June after its first memb= ership is chosen, after which point it shall exist for =E2=80=8Bfully =E2= =80=8Bfour =E2=80=8Bcalendrical =E2=80=8Byears and six =E2=80=8Bcalendrical= =E2=80=8Bmonths and then =E2=80=8Bshall =E2=80=8Bbe dissolved=E2=80=8B, di= sconstituted,=E2=80=8B and discontinued in its entirety, unless its lifetim= e is extended=E2=80=8B and such expiration is delayed in part or whole by e= xplicit=E2=80=8B official action of the LLG; upon it=E2=80=8Bs expiration= =E2=80=8B (described previously)=E2=80=8B, all of its =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2= =80=8B=E2=80=8Bpolicy, standards, work, decisions, and other output shall d= evolve to=E2=80=8B and become the direct responsibility of=E2=80=8B the LLG= and shall persist and remain active and valid =E2=80=8Bas =E2=80=8Bpolicy,= standards, work, decisions, and other output=E2=80=8B (as appropriate) of = and in the responsibility of the LLG=E2=80=8B until the LLG=E2=80=8B explic= itly decides otherwise=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B=E2=80=8B or upon the establishment= and constitution of another body or organization under the authority of th= e LLG which has or shall have purview which nonemptily intersects that of t= he body herein described (in which case, all aforementioned pertinent =E2= =80=8Bpolicy, standards, work, decisions, and other output=E2=80=8B =E2=80= =8Bshall be inherited by and devolved to it unless otherwise specified by t= he LLG); the =E2=80=8Bfirst =E2=80=8Bmembership of the body =E2=80=8Bherein= constituted =E2=80=8Bshall be =E2=80=8Bselected in a manner which the LLG = decides =E2=80=8Bto be appropriate, which shall be determined later=E2=80= =8B by the LLG; thereafter, all other selection and regulation of its membe= rship shall be under the primary authority and review of the body itself, a= lthough any regular selection of new membership shall not occur prior to th= e elapse of fully two calendrical years and six calendrical months after th= e original establishment of the body=E2=80=8B and selection of its first me= mbership; all membership applications and notice for such application shall= be public; eligibility=C2=A0requirements for membership to the body shall = be subject to review and change by the LLG and must be explicitly establish= ed, with explicit permission of the LLG, prior to the selection of any new = membership of the body.=E2=80=8B The name of the body herein constituted sh= all be determined by the LLG during or prior to, and as part of, the select= ion of its first membership.=E2=80=8B"

_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list
Llg-members@loj= ban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-membe= rs

_______________________________________________
Llg-members mailing list=
Llg-members= @lojban.org
http://mail.lojban.org/mailman/listinfo/llg-membe= rs
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