From lojbab@lojban.org Mon Aug 07 11:16:51 2006 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list llg-members); Mon, 07 Aug 2006 11:16:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eastrmmtao04.cox.net ([68.230.240.35]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GA9ef-0006Ro-OY for llg-members@lojban.org; Mon, 07 Aug 2006 11:16:49 -0700 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (really [24.250.99.39]) by eastrmmtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.01 201-2131-130-101-20060113) with ESMTP id <20060807181641.KZSE25210.eastrmmtao04.cox.net@[127.0.0.1]> for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 14:16:41 -0400 Message-ID: <44D78387.4010705@lojban.org> Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 14:16:39 -0400 From: Bob LeChevalier User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: llg-members@lojban.org Subject: [llg-members] Re: LLG 2006 Annual Meeting Thread References: <20060707224943.GB18983@chain.digitalkingdom.org> <20060807041126.GE28190@chain.digitalkingdom.org> <44D6D0E3.30801@lojban.org> <44D77A08.9080800@kli.org> In-Reply-To: <44D77A08.9080800@kli.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -2.6 (--) X-archive-position: 237 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: llg-members-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: llg-members-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lojbab@lojban.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: llg-members@lojban.org X-list: llg-members Mark E. Shoulson wrote: > I hope to be able to attend if something materializes. The previous > LogFest-cum-Philcon, for all its short notice, was an excellent > experience. Lawrence Schoen lives in the Philadelphia area and is a > Science-Fiction writer, so it is a safe bet that he will at least be at > Philcon even if we don't arrange things in advance. I think, though, > that Klingon/Lojban joint programming, while possibly a good idea and > worth persuing, will not be remarkably enlightening for those already > interested in Lojban (or Klingon). It *will* make for some nice > headlines and might garner some interest as some sort of "battle" or > "debate" (people can't resist imagining a conflict between Klingon and > Lojban), and that can only help us, simply by raising our profile and > people's awareness of Lojban. > > My point is, really, that while we should definitely support and work > for such a joint program, we should realize that it's mainly for show > and we're not going to gain any real insights from it. Then again, what > insights could we have hoped to gain anyway? I don't think our idea was ever to gain insights. Maybe to provide insights to people unaware of the ones we've already come up with. If we are going to have a LogFest at a convention that has Lawrence around, then adding a programming thread pertaining to languages and linguistics would a) bolster the convention by giving it a new programming theme which many SF people find interesting (and providing programming to a convention makes the convention people happy, and it motivates them to support our participation by treating us well) b) allow attendees to find out about both languages and their different communities, natures, styles, goals, issues, and methods of advancement c) show the world that we are NOT engaged in a battle with each other - that the conlang world isn't (just) a bunch of esperantists bickering with everyone else about which language is best, which is the impression that some people have. d) adding some programming makes LogFest more serious as a gathering and less of a social event (not that socializing isn't good, but having something more, and pre-organized, makes it better) e) the more that is going on, the more desirable it is to Lojbanists to attend. Better turnout at LogFest means that it is more interesting and important as a Lojban event, and thus makes it more likely that those coming for the Lojban part of LogFest will have their attendance made worthwhile. f) with several thousand attendees who include the sorts of people who are often intrigued by Lojban and artificial languages, programming is potentially a superior advertising and recruiting tool. Unlike our con efforts 15 years ago, however, our now much improved website and multitude of online activities gives us something to point to so that those who attend and are interested can follow up after the convention. So recruiting at cons makes more sense now than it did. The last three are specific to us and don't need Lawrence. The first three need a variety of people of varying interests and personalities, so as to make for entertaining and interesting discussions. And programming, in order to be any good, usually needs some advanced planning. People who have planned in advance are more likely to have something to say and to say it coherently. lojbab