From cr@cosmicray.co.uk Wed Aug 19 00:25:31 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list llg-members); Wed, 19 Aug 2009 00:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de ([212.227.126.187]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MdfXw-00008Z-Ug for llg-members@lojban.org; Wed, 19 Aug 2009 00:25:31 -0700 Received: from [192.168.1.100] (82-71-48-121.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.71.48.121]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mreu1) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKv1o-1MdfXq0DOk-000H1X; Wed, 19 Aug 2009 09:25:18 +0200 Message-ID: <4A8BA8DD.7050206@cosmicray.co.uk> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2009 08:25:17 +0100 From: CosmicRay User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (Windows/20090605) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: llg-members@lojban.org Subject: [llg-members] Re: [cr@cosmicray.co.uk: [Fwd: Lojban Ideas]] References: <20090816032146.GC21886@mercury.ccil.org> <4A896567.6040106@kli.org> In-Reply-To: <4A896567.6040106@kli.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18IJSGu+s6wer4VFBCFcmDnEZbbEWgrGqcBf1f KeY+6zXuveFUr0jvS/Jy46DWwcEtY0S270xuydV8QOtojhHmvy 7KyqbAomZFdv1Q2P4E0zg== X-archive-position: 732 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: llg-members-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: llg-members-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: cr@cosmicray.co.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-to: llg-members@lojban.org X-list: llg-members Mark E. Shoulson wrote: > From: CosmicRay > >> 3. Exams and qualifications >> >> > I can say from experience with the KLI's certification that this is a > Good Idea, and we should have moved on it earlier. Many people > definitely feel motivated by the prospect of earning the rank and those > little pins (we should also have some sort of badge; it really gives > people something to strive for). Arika wrote about that some in her book. > > (and generally, we should have some sort of Lojban or LLG badge. I have > a bunch of little 1-inch buttons I made on cafepress with the Lojban > emblem on them, which are okay, but something enamel would be cooler. > It can also elicit questions from nosy people peering at your jacket) > I haven't seen the KLI badges, but I really like this idea a lot. How does that system work, are they part of the formal award given to every successful candidate, or is it that passing a level of qualification gives someone the "right" to wear particular insignia that happens to be available from the same source? Personally I prefer the latter but only because we'd want public perception of Lojban qualifications to have the same prestige as for any major language, and not risk it being seen as the language that comes with a "free gift in every box". Merchandising in general could be, if executed well so as not to be tacky, a neat way to support the language and the LLG, what are the people here's views on that? How would we ensure merchandise is culturally neutral and can appeal to people of all origins? > It might be worthwhile to contact d'Armond Speers about his Klingon > certification tests; he really worked at making them standard and > regularized, and also having multiple versions per level, so you aren't > necessarily taking the same test each time when you fail. > Would you be able to follow up on making contact? I'm in agreement, there will need to be multiple versions per level and, at least annually, a review of all exam material to ensure it's aligned with changes in Lojban. > >> I propose a project to design one or more levels of qualification >> with exams split into a few parts that can be conducted remotely such as: >> >> * Basic comprehension through timed multiple-choice exams, can be >> completely automated via web >> * Listening and written comprehension exams, with work submitted to a >> human examiner via web >> * Spoken exams, with a human examiner, via Skype >> >> > KLI exams are only given in person, I guess for additional security in > proctoring or something. > I think this point needs to be debated; exams in person is definitely the ideal scenario, but becomes a major stumbling block to globalising the availability of the qualifications. Perhaps only the lower levels can be administered remotely, with candidates sitting higher levels having to attend a local (perhaps by extending a version of the charter idea to cover Lojban educational groups) LLG-licensed "chapter", for want of a better word. > >> Qualifications can be graded in much the same way as those for any >> other language, with the highest levels of candidate being awarded >> diplomas and lettering. Exams must be paid for by the student or an >> accredited body, adding credence and authority to the exam being sat, >> and adding to the LLG's funds. >> >> > I'm tellin' ya, cheesy metal trinkets. > Works for me ;-) kozmikreis