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From: Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu>
To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] One Ring inscription translation.
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 21:30:58 -0400
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On Wednesday, March 28, 2012 10:08:25 Chris Patrick wrote:
> Hi everyone! I'm rather the nintadni, and I was attempting to translate a
> few random snippets of text into lojban for practice. I was translating t=
he
> One Ring inscription, and this is what I came up with.
>=20
> (the One Ring inscription in Black Speech)
>=20
> Ash nazg durbatul=C5=ABk,                  [ash]: one [nazg]: finger ring
> [durb-] constrain; force; dominate [-at] participle [ul] them [ul=C5=ABk]
> completive form of 'them'
> ash nazg gimbatul,                     [gimb-]: seek out; discover
> ash nazg thrakatul=C5=ABk                  [thrak-]: bring by force; drag=
; to
> compel (something or someone) to go
> agh burzum-ishi krimpatul.           [agh]: and [burzum]: darkness [ishi]=
:
> in; inside [krimp-]: bind;  tie
>=20
> Translated:
> pa lo degja'i ku minde ro ri
> .i pa lo degja'i ku facki ri
> .i pa lo degja'i ku klami'e ri
> .i ri jongau ra ne'i lo xekri
>=20
> As I hope you're able to tell, I tried to keep the metre of the original.

The natural rhythm of English is iambic (although there is much variation a=
nd=20
the first three feet of this sentence are amphibrachyes); that of Lojban is=
=20
amphibrachic. I don't know what the natural rhythm of Black Speech is.

> The main questions I had when translating:
> - {manku} doesn't rhyme with "ri", so I used {xekri}. Does {lo xekri} mea=
n
> "the blackness"? Is there a word with similar meaning to {manku} that I
> could use and still have the line rhyme?

I generally don't try to rhyme when composing or translating poetry in Lojb=
an,=20
though if sensible words rhyme, it's fine with me. I'd say "manku" or "ka=
=20
manku".

> - I couldn't find a gismu for "retrive", in line 3. Would {bevri} have
> worked there? Or is it fine the way I did it?

How about "cpacu" or "jajgau"?

> Any relevant advice or corrections would be much appreciated.

I'd translate the first verb by "bapli".

Either "degja'i" or "djine" would describe the One Ring. The others, IIRR t=
hey=20
have jewels on one side, so they aren't djine.

"pa lo degja'i" repeated three times sounds to me like there are three ring=
s.

How about this?
.i le pa degja'i ku bapli ro zo'e
.i le pa degja'i ku facki
.i le pa degja'i ku jajgau ro zo'e
.i ne'i lo manku ku lasna
(I tried "gi'e kai lo manku" but got a syntax error.)

If I remember right, the Tengwar inscription uses two different letters for=
=20
"r". Does that mean that Black Speech has two rhotics?

Pierre
--=20
Don't buy a French car in Holland. It may be a citroen.

--=20
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