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Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] xu kau
From: Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>
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I always thought of xukau as intended to mean you're asking a rhetorical
question.

On Mon, Jun 4, 2012 at 7:21 AM, tengo <yurock.tengo@gmail.com> wrote:

> coi
>
> I have read about {xu} and {kau}, and I find most usage of {xu kau}
> odd. As I understand {xu}, it puts the main bridi into question, not a
> sub-bridi. Consider the following example:
>
> do djuno lo du'u la .frank. cu bebna
> You know that Frank is foolish
>
> First I add {xu}:
>
> do djuno lo du'u xu la .frank. cu bebna
> Is it true that you know that Frank is foolish?
> Do you know that Frank is foolish?
>
> So, it's now a question. Then I add {kau}:
>
> do djuno lo du'u xu kau la .frank. cu bebna
> Whether you know that Frank is foolish.
>
> Which is what seems odd to me. The CLL has an example in chapter 11:
>
> 7.3)   mi djuno le jei la frank. cu bebna [kei]
>       I know the truth-value of Frank being a fool.
>
> And later in the text: "I know whether or not Frank is a fool", which
> seems to be the intended meaning of {mi djuno lo du'u xu kau
> la .frank. cu bebna}.
>
> So, is there a special rule for interpretation of {xu kau}? If yes,
> where is it defined? Is the {jei}-version still correct with current
> definitions of {jei} and {djuno}?
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Lojban Beginners" group.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
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> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at
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>
>


-- 
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

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I always thought of xukau as intended to mean you&#39;re asking a rhetorica=
l question.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 4, 2012 at 7:21 A=
M, tengo <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yurock.tengo@gmail.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">yurock.tengo@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">coi<br>
<br>
I have read about {xu} and {kau}, and I find most usage of {xu kau}<br>
odd. As I understand {xu}, it puts the main bridi into question, not a<br>
sub-bridi. Consider the following example:<br>
<br>
do djuno lo du&#39;u la .frank. cu bebna<br>
You know that Frank is foolish<br>
<br>
First I add {xu}:<br>
<br>
do djuno lo du&#39;u xu la .frank. cu bebna<br>
Is it true that you know that Frank is foolish?<br>
Do you know that Frank is foolish?<br>
<br>
So, it&#39;s now a question. Then I add {kau}:<br>
<br>
do djuno lo du&#39;u xu kau la .frank. cu bebna<br>
Whether you know that Frank is foolish.<br>
<br>
Which is what seems odd to me. The CLL has an example in chapter 11:<br>
<br>
7.3) =A0 mi djuno le jei la frank. cu bebna [kei]<br>
 =A0 =A0 =A0 I know the truth-value of Frank being a fool.<br>
<br>
And later in the text: &quot;I know whether or not Frank is a fool&quot;, w=
hich<br>
seems to be the intended meaning of {mi djuno lo du&#39;u xu kau<br>
la .frank. cu bebna}.<br>
<br>
So, is there a special rule for interpretation of {xu kau}? If yes,<br>
where is it defined? Is the {jei}-version still correct with current<br>
definitions of {jei} and {djuno}?<br>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
--<br>
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &=
quot;Lojban Beginners&quot; group.<br>
To post to this group, send email to <a href=3D"mailto:lojban-beginners@goo=
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roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den</a>.<br>
<br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br>mu&#39;o =
mi&#39;e .aionys.<br><br>.i.e&#39;ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi=
.luk. mi patfu do zo&#39;o<br>(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father=
. :D )<br>
<br>

<p></p>

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/>
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-beginners?hl=3Den.<br />



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