Received: from mail-we0-f189.google.com ([74.125.82.189]:50790) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1SoFpF-0004L8-SP; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:51 -0700 Received: by werl57 with SMTP id l57sf1576149wer.16 for ; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=/JKhDSSZ8Xba/3tTMDze1krjBgTutVQrdUX3L1xKfeI=; b=TRpKyONXUxc8ryXMznu2zcMrzmwzsLUfJjDo2o8F4ENYT24cqJB7kwS62akhmc11mF HRBAwvJ+nuPDez4jsPj6K8BSr7mmMGd/eeirmE1TPJfCavxRkdsh/pGE1iqxAbuFLLEX wRlru/iqALn/8vhpKUYwcgGv2s5ySlSJgpt1Y= Received: by 10.204.143.137 with SMTP id v9mr1215871bku.8.1341847469589; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:29 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.205.119.129 with SMTP id fu1ls407656bkc.4.gmail; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.130.7 with SMTP id q7mr3171998bks.2.1341847467926; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.130.7 with SMTP id q7mr3171996bks.2.1341847467884; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lb0-f169.google.com (mail-lb0-f169.google.com [209.85.217.169]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id p5si16574916bks.1.2012.07.09.08.24.27 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.169 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.217.169; Received: by lbjn8 with SMTP id n8so10934027lbj.0 for ; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.112.84.65 with SMTP id w1mr18581991lby.40.1341847467199; Mon, 09 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.152.46.36 with HTTP; Mon, 9 Jul 2012 08:24:27 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <9722108c-4b9e-4200-af66-4d838bb99065@googlegroups.com> References: <1897ed28-8a5d-4a2c-8916-8bad921c8240@googlegroups.com> <3fe35f00-2292-47f2-8174-e085ac192707@googlegroups.com> <12445105.L7OIGU9naY@mehitabel> <636d3cc9-86ce-43f7-b181-146391653181@googlegroups.com> <33c7e7dd-2010-4672-9961-1616d06b1677@googlegroups.com> <9722108c-4b9e-4200-af66-4d838bb99065@googlegroups.com> Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2012 09:24:27 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: zo'oi pomegranate se fanva fu ma From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.217.169 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f46d0401696da00cd504c4673558 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --f46d0401696da00cd504c4673558 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I wouldn't say "no relation". They're both fruit. :) And it's not maglico to translate a name that in nearly every language is derived from it's LATIN name. On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 9:12 AM, gleki wrote: > > > On Monday, July 9, 2012 6:07:15 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote: >> >> I got {tsiplise} by looking up the etymology of "pomegranate", which is >> "seeded apple". Adding more bits just makes the word more complicated. >> > It does. That's why I like it. But it's malglico if we copy the structure > of zo'oi pomegranate > And that's might be a drawback. > Pomegranates have no relation to apples. > >> >> On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:43 AM, Paul Predkiewicz < >> paul.predkiewicz@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I think {tsiplise} is awesome. Allthough it's pulp really is more like >>> from a berry, but since on the outside it looks like an apple, one >>> might consider {tsijbaplise} >>> >>> Or, you could even put the phoenecians into the game, "who were active >>> in broadening its cultivation, partly for religious reasons." as >>> wikipedia puts it. >>> >>> just my 2 one-hundredth subdivisions of several units of currency... >>> >>> On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 8:42 AM, Jonathan Jones >>> wrote: >>> > That's not a Lojban specific thing. Every language has that. >>> > >>> > For example, you can call a person attractive, pretty, beautiful, >>> handsome, >>> > sexy, cute, hot,... >>> > >>> > >>> > On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 12:33 AM, gleki >>> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> It just reminds me of tatoeba where many lojbanic sentences have 2-3 >>> >> versions like jbobau/banjubu'o/la .lojban. >>> >> Flexibility and synonymy is great but sometimes we need to choose one >>> way >>> >> not to be misunderstood by others. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> On Monday, July 9, 2012 10:05:56 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Should? I can't answer that. Do it if you want to. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 11:32 PM, gleki >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>> >>>> On Sunday, July 8, 2012 10:10:36 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote: >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> Personally, being one of those people who hates fu'ivla of any >>> kind, I >>> >>>>> like {tsiplise}, myself. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> (facepalm) >>> >>>> I like this word too. Should I create a third version of this pixra? >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Pierre Abbat >>> >>>>> wrote: >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> On Sunday, July 08, 2012 01:10:26 AM gleki wrote: >>> >>>>>> > Type 3 fu'ivla is not unnaturalistic at all. Ancient Egyptian >>> >>>>>> > (ju'ocu'i the >>> >>>>>> > eldest written language that we are aware of) >>> >>>>>> > actually had such type of words. >>> >>>>>> > e.g. >>> >>>>>> > [image: nfr][image: nfr][image: nfr][image: pr] pronounced as >>> *nfrw >>> >>>>>> > *means >>> >>>>>> > "foundations of a house" where [image: pr] means house in order >>> to >>> >>>>>> > distinguish it from other homophones pronounced as *nfrw* as >>> well. >>> >>>>>> > >>> >>>>>> > It's like {grutrgranate} and {tricrgranate} in Lojban. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> The Egyptian writing system has nothing to do with rafsi >>> classifiers >>> >>>>>> on >>> >>>>>> borrowed words. A better natlang example of a type-3 fu'ivla is >>> >>>>>> "weeverfish" >>> >>>>>> (or "weaverfish"), where "weever" is from Old French and "fish" is >>> >>>>>> native. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> On Sunday, July 08, 2012 01:11:35 AM gleki wrote: >>> >>>>>> > Sorry to say but I have to support Lindar's {granatu} Type 4 >>> >>>>>> > fu'ivla. >>> >>>>>> > Don't ask me for any logic in such decision cuz I said earlier >>> there >>> >>>>>> > could >>> >>>>>> > be no logic in this field at all. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> It could be "granatu" or "granato" in my opinion, but I prefer >>> both of >>> >>>>>> them to >>> >>>>>> "granate", which is the vocative, which was lost. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> Another possibility is "rimbone" or "rumbona", from Semitic, with >>> "b" >>> >>>>>> thrown >>> >>>>>> in for the morphology. >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> Pierre >>> >>>>>> -- >>> >>>>>> li fi'u vu'u fi'u fi'u du li pa >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>>> -- >>> >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> >>>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> >>>>>> lojban-beginners@googlegroups.**com >>> . >>> >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> >>>>>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com >>> . >>> >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> >>>>>> http://groups.google.com/**group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >>> . >>> >>>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> -- >>> >>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>> >>>>> >>> >>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do >>> zo'o >>> >>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>> >>>>> >>> >>>> -- >>> >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> >>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/**msg/lojban-beginners/-/**SGgSkFT9VIcJ >>> . >>> >>>> >>> >>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups. >>> **com . >>> >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> >>>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com >>> . >>> >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> >>>> http://groups.google.com/**group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >>> . >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>> >>> >>> >>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>> >>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>> >>> >>> >> -- >>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups >>> >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> >> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> >> https://groups.google.com/d/**msg/lojban-beginners/-/**Zkn6EUXdGYAJ >>> . >>> >> >>> >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.** >>> com . >>> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com >>> . >>> >> For more options, visit this group at >>> >> http://groups.google.com/**group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >>> . >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>> > >>> > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>> > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>> > >>> > -- >>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups >>> > "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.** >>> com . >>> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com >>> . >>> > For more options, visit this group at >>> > http://groups.google.com/**group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >>> . >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.**com >>> . >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com >>> . >>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/** >>> group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >>> . >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/L6NRHvKjVWsJ. > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. --f46d0401696da00cd504c4673558 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I wouldn't say "no relation". They're both fruit. :)
<= br>And it's not maglico to translate a name that in nearly every langua= ge is derived from it's LATIN name.

On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 9:12 AM, gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com= > wrote:


On Monday, July 9, 2012 6:07:15 PM UTC+4, aionys = wrote:
I got {tsiplise} by looking u= p the etymology of "pomegranate", which is "seeded apple&quo= t;. Adding more bits just makes the word more complicated.
It does. That's why I like it. But it's mal= glico if we copy the structure of zo'oi pomegranate
And that&= #39;s might be a drawback.
Pomegranates have no relation to apple= s.=A0

On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:43 AM, Paul Predkiewicz <paul.predkiewicz@gmail.com> wrote:
I think {tsiplise} is awesome. Allthough it&= #39;s pulp really is more like
from a berry, but since on the outside it looks like an apple, one
might consider {tsijbaplise}

Or, you could even put the phoenecians into the game, "who were active=
in broadening its cultivation, partly for religious reasons." as
wikipedia puts it.

just my 2 one-hundredth subdivisions of several units of currency...

On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 8:42 AM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> That's not a Lojban specific thing. Every language has that.
>
> For example, you can call a person attractive, pretty, beautiful, hand= some,
> sexy, cute, hot,...
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 12:33 AM, gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wro= te:
>>
>> It just reminds me of tatoeba where many lojbanic sentences have 2= -3
>> versions like jbobau/banjubu'o/la .lojban.
>> Flexibility and synonymy is great but sometimes we need to choose = one way
>> not to be misunderstood by others.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, July 9, 2012 10:05:56 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>>>
>>> Should? I can't answer that. Do it if you want to.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 11:32 PM, gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com= >
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Sunday, July 8, 2012 10:10:36 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote: >>>>>
>>>>> Personally, being one of those people who hates fu'= ;ivla of any kind, I
>>>>> like {tsiplise}, myself.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> (facepalm)
>>>> I like this word too. Should I create a third version of t= his pixra?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu&= gt;
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sunday, July 08, 2012 01:10:26 AM gleki wrote:<= br> >>>>>> > Type 3 fu'ivla is not unnaturalistic at a= ll. Ancient Egyptian
>>>>>> > (ju'ocu'i the
>>>>>> > eldest written language that we are aware of)=
>>>>>> > actually had such type of words.
>>>>>> > e.g.
>>>>>> > [image: nfr][image: nfr][image: nfr][image: p= r] pronounced as *nfrw
>>>>>> > *means
>>>>>> > "foundations of a house" where [ima= ge: pr] means house in order to
>>>>>> > distinguish it from other homophones pronounc= ed as *nfrw* as well.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > It's like {grutrgranate} and {tricrgranat= e} in Lojban.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Egyptian writing system has nothing to do with= rafsi classifiers
>>>>>> on
>>>>>> borrowed words. A better natlang example of a type= -3 fu'ivla is
>>>>>> "weeverfish"
>>>>>> (or "weaverfish"), where "weever&qu= ot; is from Old French and "fish" is
>>>>>> native.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sunday, July 08, 2012 01:11:35 AM gleki wrote:<= br> >>>>>> > Sorry to say but I have to support Lindar'= ;s {granatu} Type 4
>>>>>> > fu'ivla.
>>>>>> > Don't ask me for any logic in such decisi= on cuz I said earlier there
>>>>>> > could
>>>>>> > be no logic in this field at all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It could be "granatu" or "granato&q= uot; in my opinion, but I prefer both of
>>>>>> them to
>>>>>> "granate", which is the vocative, which = was lost.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Another possibility is "rimbone" or &quo= t;rumbona", from Semitic, with "b"
>>>>>> thrown
>>>>>> in for the morphology.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pierre
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> li fi'u vu'u fi'u fi'u du li pa >>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscrib= ed to the Google
>>>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to
>>>>>> lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>>>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@goog= legroups.com.
>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/l= ojban-beginners?hl=3Den.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>>>>>
>>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk= . mi patfu do zo'o
>>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to th= e Google
>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/= lojban-beginners/-/SGgSkFT9VIcJ.
>>>>
>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegr= oups.com.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups= .com.
>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-be= ginners?hl=3Den.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>>>
>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi pat= fu do zo'o
>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google= Groups
>> "Lojban Beginners" group.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-b= eginners/-/Zkn6EUXdGYAJ.
>>
>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.= com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com= .
>> For more options, visit this group at
>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?= hl=3Den.
>
>
>
>
> --
> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>
> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo= 'o
> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Gro= ups
> "Lojban Beginners" group.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.= com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl= =3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= u>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.




--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/L6NRHvKjVWsJ.
=

=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.



--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
--f46d0401696da00cd504c4673558--