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From: Jacob Errington <nictytan@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2012 11:09:26 -0400
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Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Where should I use sets and where should I use masses?
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On 2 September 2012 11:03, Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, Sep 2, 2012 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Errington <nictytan@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Sets are required in some places in lojban, such as simxu1 and cmima2
> (these
> > relationships don't actually involve the underlying properties of the
> > elements of the set)
> >
> > e.g. lo'i ro jbopre cu simxu lo ka ce'u slabu ce'u -> All lojbanists kn=
ow
> > each other.
> > e.g. ko cmima lo'i jbopre -> Join the lojbanists!
>
> The disadvantage of defining "simxu" and "cmima" that way, is that you
> can't easily say things like:
>
> lo ro jbopre cu zvati ti gi'e simxu lo ka ce'u slabu ce'u
> All lojbanists are here and know each other.
>
> I don't see any advantage to defining "simxu" and the few other gismu
> that are defined that way in terms of sets, so I use them as if they
> were defined in a more user-friendly manner, in terms of ordinary
> groups rather than mathematical sets.
>

Of course, if we work under the assumption that {lo} produces the weird
polymorphic type, then yes, you can get away with shenanigans like that,
but if you don't, you need an experimental in the form of a sort of JAI
that can do afterthought LAhE in the way JAI TAG does afterthought TAG.

.i mi'e la tsani mu'o


>
> mu'o mi'e xorxes
>
> --
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> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
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> For more options, visit this group at
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>
>

--=20
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On 2 September 2012 11:03, Jorge Llamb=EDas <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:jjllambias@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jjllambias@gmail.com</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br><div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex">

<div class=3D"im">On Sun, Sep 2, 2012 at 11:47 AM, Jacob Errington &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:nictytan@gmail.com">nictytan@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Sets are required in some places in lojban, such as simxu1 and cmima2 =
(these<br>
&gt; relationships don&#39;t actually involve the underlying properties of =
the<br>
&gt; elements of the set)<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; e.g. lo&#39;i ro jbopre cu simxu lo ka ce&#39;u slabu ce&#39;u -&gt; A=
ll lojbanists know<br>
&gt; each other.<br>
&gt; e.g. ko cmima lo&#39;i jbopre -&gt; Join the lojbanists!<br>
<br>
</div>The disadvantage of defining &quot;simxu&quot; and &quot;cmima&quot; =
that way, is that you<br>
can&#39;t easily say things like:<br>
<br>
lo ro jbopre cu zvati ti gi&#39;e simxu lo ka ce&#39;u slabu ce&#39;u<br>
All lojbanists are here and know each other.<br>
<br>
I don&#39;t see any advantage to defining &quot;simxu&quot; and the few oth=
er gismu<br>
that are defined that way in terms of sets, so I use them as if they<br>
were defined in a more user-friendly manner, in terms of ordinary<br>
groups rather than mathematical sets.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>O=
f course, if we work under the assumption that {lo} produces the weird poly=
morphic type, then yes, you can get away with shenanigans like that, but if=
 you don&#39;t, you need an experimental in the form of a sort of JAI that =
can do afterthought LAhE in the way JAI TAG does afterthought TAG.</div>

<div><br></div><div>.i mi&#39;e la tsani mu&#39;o</div><div>=A0</div><block=
quote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc=
 solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
mu&#39;o mi&#39;e xorxes<br>
<div class=3D"im HOEnZb"><br>
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nners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com">lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegr=
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roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den</a>.<br>
<br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

<p></p>

-- <br />
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/>
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