Received: from mail-da0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:64636) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Tc3kL-0005Hc-Gh; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:30 -0800 Received: by mail-da0-f61.google.com with SMTP id z8sf3343578dad.16 for ; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to:references :subject:mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence :mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=tUn9U75eQCyXiwYdN7pYEkhOeSvyP/yzhMntzFHPsBg=; b=UJSF8qLg9VJMgCg3/YPyiNjVEbuBWwL6aqZ42J06YbXE7VacwvNTVcJgl+m3hMkYyP k/2c3qyv0bOgpousn+isLdsc88x65XHtvXY8JqrbKXQ4MWBxLBattGM68iwMdag+UYve 54FAlKY3tYCG2aTM/DzAasbEHU18Id3R9TvMW6pmVJNk5TRQ8uK5vzR+Y53HaVavb/wt a6s/qRJ0ROhN8FB2Yhv2NeutkankQeFfLfX199K47BHnC/RHfLbmXtx4/yS66Uvn6NIz jUQlcOgdG5ens8B35CFsLfPuC3MA/Wew7lO3Mgq6xN8McWWej6O0X7K119u3TVP6zxQW XtZg== Received: by 10.49.60.40 with SMTP id e8mr846471qer.40.1353717439035; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:19 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.24.37 with SMTP id r5ls561667qef.85.gmail; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.71.6 with SMTP id q6mr855906qeu.10.1353717438661; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:18 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2012 16:37:18 -0800 (PST) From: mudri To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Cc: park.annie@asb.gaggle.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References:

<461d8410-7da9-44ca-8714-33965aaf93ca@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Question MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: jammyatjammy@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_692_33214365.1353717438374" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / ------=_Part_692_33214365.1353717438374 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Basically, so that it can be used in YACC. To appreciate that answer fully, you'd need to know some basic conventions used in context-free grammar notation. On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:30:33 UTC, Annie wrote: > > Since it's not really a letter, why would you want to capitalize the > apostrophe? > > Sent from my iPod > > On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:20 PM, mudri > > wrote: > > The curly braces are quotes for Lojban text within text of other > languages. I'm not quite sure why they're used, but it's a kind of standard. > > For upper case apostrophe, I'll give the example of the name of selma'o > {KOhA} (again, braces are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}. So, as 'K' > is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe. > > On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:14:36 UTC, Annie wrote: >> >> Are you saying that left-brace is sort of a letter? What do you mean by >> upper apostrophe, or whatever? >> >> Sent from my iPod >> >> On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri wrote: >> >> Just to add something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostrophe >> (both called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, >> though it is very common in these. >> >> It is called a "half letter" sometimes for various reasons. Matt >> explained how it only appears between vowels, and is unique in this respect >> (commas, if I remember correctly, can be used next to syllabic consonants - >> but that's unimportant). The apostrophe also has no effect on morphology: >> CVV and CV'V syllables behave identically (other than having different >> meanings). Finally, it is counted almost literally as half a letter in the >> lujvo scoring algorithm. "Something that acts as half a letter", I suppose >> someone thought, "should have 'half' a glyph, pe'a". >> >> On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie wrote: >>> >>> I found out that in Lojban, there's apparently no h. How is that so, >>> when the apostrophe is practically the h? >>> >>> Sent from my iPod >>> >>> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/-zJpIwnUk9EJ. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com > . > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > > > > > > > *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/QtRV2fHf8cMJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. ------=_Part_692_33214365.1353717438374 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Basically, so that it can be used in YACC. To appreciate that answer fully,= you'd need to know some basic conventions used in context-free grammar not= ation.
On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:30:33 UTC, Annie wrote:

Since it's not = really a letter, why would you want to capitalize the apostrophe?

Se= nt from my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:20 PM, mudri <= jammya...@gmail.com> wrote:

<= div>The curly braces are quotes for Lojban text within text of other langua= ges. I'm not quite sure why they're used, but it's a kind of standard.
=
For upper case apostrophe, I'll give the example of the name= of selma'o {KOhA} (again, braces are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}= . So, as 'K' is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe.

On Saturday,= 24 November 2012 00:14:36 UTC, Annie wrote:
Are you saying that left-brace is sort of = a letter? What do you mean by upper apostrophe, or whatever?

Sent from my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri &l= t;jammya...@gmail.com> wrote:

Just to add something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostr= ophe (both called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, = though it is very common in these.

It is called a "half = letter" sometimes for various reasons. Matt explained how it only appears b= etween vowels, and is unique in this respect (commas, if I remember correct= ly, can be used next to syllabic consonants - but that's unimportant). The = apostrophe also has no effect on morphology: CVV and CV'V syllables behave = identically (other than having different meanings). Finally, it is counted = almost literally as half a letter in the lujvo scoring algorithm. "Somethin= g that acts as half a letter", I suppose someone thought, "should have 'hal= f' a glyph, pe'a".

On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie = wrote:
I found out that in Lojban, t= here's apparently no h. How is that so, when the apostrophe is practically = the h?

Sent from my iPod

*** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/-zJpIwnUk9EJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@goo= glegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= wbr>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.

*** This Email was sent by a s= tudent at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.co= m.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= wbr>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.

*** This Email was sent by a s= tudent at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/l= ojban-beginners/-/QtRV2fHf8cMJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
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