Received: from mail-qa0-f61.google.com ([209.85.216.61]:57021) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TcC4V-00083z-DZ; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:53 -0800 Received: by mail-qa0-f61.google.com with SMTP id d18sf1475853qae.16 for ; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=jPlakKalSoaWtbA9+KTBHlr+qbbiPf12XC2s+24dTPA=; b=kaGCRxTBYBCGLkVzBudwzn1NUwFyMt1V0EimA+p7fdIm1yIVal4ouMmsHxn9+FPN8v AzIzyvS8/ZjJSEXzHh3/3oVv0Dhvw/ldgJ4F8G6CHTFe3/S5SGfdZVfle/vM/z+gV+5a zjPiIhXY/ed6oU6QtO0Zh+bVB6+0x4hXwZTbERoBe03E7AEReXUI02crfjz640cpcvie 2LX8G9LxDxsrqXa3H6DpI3k2T55IdNesirwLuO/BNWdxaHYMw+WkB3xNum/iIaIlKr1c jBT3eda663diEGWoUG5HRp06OE8B435N8fvQLBrHgHjow2H9q81J5SB7bpuQHSu7RQp/ 7SCQ== Received: by 10.50.163.66 with SMTP id yg2mr2596447igb.0.1353749440326; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:40 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.33.139 with SMTP id r11ls1145800igi.16.canary; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.62.148 with SMTP id y20mr4355830ich.19.1353749439800; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.62.148 with SMTP id y20mr4355828ich.19.1353749439751; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oa0-f49.google.com (mail-oa0-f49.google.com [209.85.219.49]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id s15si812531igi.1.2012.11.24.01.30.39 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.219.49 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.219.49; Received: by mail-oa0-f49.google.com with SMTP id l10so9267838oag.36 for ; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.21.135 with SMTP id v7mr4825630obe.101.1353749439389; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.60.94.71 with HTTP; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:30:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <461d8410-7da9-44ca-8714-33965aaf93ca@googlegroups.com> References: <461d8410-7da9-44ca-8714-33965aaf93ca@googlegroups.com> Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2012 02:30:39 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Question From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.219.49 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=14dae93b637473215304cf3a5a5f X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --14dae93b637473215304cf3a5a5f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 5:20 PM, mudri wrote: > The curly braces are quotes for Lojban text within text of other > languages. I'm not quite sure why they're used, but it's a kind of standard. I'm pretty sure it came about as a means of signalling that the enclosed text was in Lojban. There are some words, like {santa}, for instance, that are also words in English, and I'd bet other languages too, so "santa" isn't as clearly the Lojban word as {santa} is. As to why '{ }' in the first place, my guess is is that it's because '( )', '[ ]', and '< >' either already have a different use in English or doesn't look as 'cool'. (santa) [santa] {santa}. > For upper case apostrophe, I'll give the example of the name of selma'o > {KOhA} (again, braces are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}. So, as 'K' > is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe. > > > On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:14:36 UTC, Annie wrote: > >> Are you saying that left-brace is sort of a letter? What do you mean by >> upper apostrophe, or whatever? >> >> Sent from my iPod >> >> On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri wrote: >> >> Just to add something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostrophe >> (both called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, >> though it is very common in these. >> >> It is called a "half letter" sometimes for various reasons. Matt >> explained how it only appears between vowels, and is unique in this respect >> (commas, if I remember correctly, can be used next to syllabic consonants - >> but that's unimportant). The apostrophe also has no effect on morphology: >> CVV and CV'V syllables behave identically (other than having different >> meanings). Finally, it is counted almost literally as half a letter in the >> lujvo scoring algorithm. "Something that acts as half a letter", I suppose >> someone thought, "should have 'half' a glyph, pe'a". >> >> On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie wrote: >>> >>> I found out that in Lojban, there's apparently no h. How is that so, >>> when the apostrophe is practically the h? >>> >>> Sent from my iPod >>> >>> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/** >> msg/lojban-beginners/-/-**zJpIwnUk9EJ >> . >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.**com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@** >> googlegroups.com. >> >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/** >> group/lojban-beginners?hl=en >> . >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ. > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. --14dae93b637473215304cf3a5a5f Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Nov 23, 2012 at 5:20 PM, mudri <jammyatjammy@gmail.com>= ; wrote:
For upper case apostrophe= , I'll give the example of the name of selma'o {KOhA} (again, brace= s are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}. So, as 'K= 9; is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe.


On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:14:36 UTC, = Annie wrote:
Are you saying that left-brace is sort of a letter? What do you mean b= y upper apostrophe, or whatever?=A0

Sent from my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri <ja= mmya...@gmail.com> wrote:

Just to ad= d something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostrophe (both = called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, tho= ugh it is very common in these.

It is called a "half letter" sometimes for various= reasons. Matt explained how it only appears between vowels, and is unique = in this respect (commas, if I remember correctly, can be used next to sylla= bic consonants - but that's unimportant). The apostrophe also has no ef= fect on morphology: CVV and CV'V syllables behave identically (other th= an having different meanings). Finally, it is counted almost literally as h= alf a letter in the lujvo scoring algorithm. "Something that acts as h= alf a letter", I suppose someone thought, "should have 'half&= #39; a glyph, pe'a".

On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie wrote:
I found out that in Lojban, there's apparently = no h. How is that so, when the apostrophe is practically the h?

Sent from my iPod

*** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/-zJpIwnUk9EJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com= .
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@g= ooglegroups.com.

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= u>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.





*** Th= is Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.
<= /div>

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ.
=

=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.



--
= mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa = bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am yo= ur father. :D )

--
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To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
--14dae93b637473215304cf3a5a5f--