Received: from mail-qc0-f188.google.com ([209.85.216.188]:36691) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TqVFO-0001XH-57; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:29 -0800 Received: by mail-qc0-f188.google.com with SMTP id k26sf8691671qcs.15 for ; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=YhcxHyIfDAfWfzp3R5OYQyX4mZOuNktEc2sbvKxCjuo=; b=YNvT+nO8qJrY6NxpJwYNpAc5eGpHjH5mjXh0sL+IovHE8hDY6ZDjVGh4MJk+hNub4e ITtHvBWebs6w3ToPkt3s9wfdSqbFhXIVnskR0c8zXRH9MB2uFF4bKWd+MEdSRACG821Z AdXiUoLOle9PhWlQSSckfbQx/oMZ48jg3MERAXgS8l1rRyYIjkZYtyVw4/N1So7baXPe XjYg30JRBro5qud7prL8o5DheYThqHBtUr8clRdDrFjJubteea7kzhxW0fKbx/uT5y0h 5j7BxbMYJfcWg1RpO4xuU66qjP44C2/O2hslXLi8FutuKotQ0jaNfnkwspq5dXuYXnuA cuzg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:x-beenthere:x-received:x-received:received-spf :mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type; bh=YhcxHyIfDAfWfzp3R5OYQyX4mZOuNktEc2sbvKxCjuo=; b=WB1DxggROgws/c0P7AGc1G9eE5gLQ3mTy6G2uPwXrmamAOTMH+2u1YM9OWLBKvdarJ Wjb0/m+6QxWprGAgrQ7jSemX/AmzJZjC8ObLyRkCRwUKe4wmcL89iogIvR/t0fDihF5m DavrgGWT8gKqKbJRG1qWaUAPkoQIlKottkyGJCsQrC4QfsbsLHnQk0g75gdi3r5JyJe+ YNU3GutxXda9tcJIWvawGcMEMHJrHkaBD6XBd7RYK9GrwF4o0+QJBBHMvv62zMNocCHI oWNAcH80RF0+lJvEzkXrviDJGl1Aj+EmrN3aqe1zvtam01sAkFkUBHi3AldCFo1NCRIP ft1g== X-Received: by 10.50.91.165 with SMTP id cf5mr15209914igb.4.1357159743380; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:03 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.152.147 with SMTP id uy19ls10608721igb.6.gmail; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:03 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.42.175.70 with SMTP id az6mr37143829icb.33.1357159743004; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:03 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.42.175.70 with SMTP id az6mr37143826icb.33.1357159742986; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ob0-f179.google.com (mail-ob0-f179.google.com [209.85.214.179]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id vb13si4272292igb.2.2013.01.02.12.49.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.179 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.214.179; Received: by mail-ob0-f179.google.com with SMTP id x4so13267952obh.10 for ; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.182.38.69 with SMTP id e5mr38530657obk.79.1357159742815; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 12:49:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.60.178.237 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 12:49:02 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 13:49:02 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Should/Ought From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.179 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f46d04462f0e5fbf6004d2546023 X-Spam-Score: -0.1 (/) X-Spam_score: -0.1 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / --f46d04462f0e5fbf6004d2546023 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 1:44 PM, MorphemeAddict wrote: > On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:37 PM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > >> On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 1:09 PM, .arpis. wrote: >> >>> ju'o so'i roi retsku .i ku'i ji'a sai mi krefu retsku di'e .i fanva >>> zo'oi should fu ma to mu'i zoi gy. I should eat .gy. joi zoi gy. I should >>> go to the gym .gy. to mabla me zo zoi javni toi toi >>> >>> "I'm sure it's been asked many times before; even so, I ask it again: >>> How does one translate "should" (e.g. "I should eat", "I should go to the >>> gym" (Damned "zoi" rules))? >>> >> >> With gismu: >> > > I'm a little unsure about the proper Lojban word for what I mean here > (selbri?), but it seems to me that using "gismu" is overly specific. > Similar for "attitudinal" when "cmavo" would apply. Those two categories > cover all the bases (since names can't do the job). > I said gismu because that's what I used. IT's possible that other forms of selbri (eg. tanru, lujvo, etc.) would also work, but the example I used was a gismu. The same reasoning applies to the other example. > > stevo > >> >> mi bilga lonu citka >> >> >> With attitudinal (although I wouldn't be surprised if there's >> disagreement on this one): >> >> mi citka.ei >> >> >>> -- >>> mu'o mi'e .arpis. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. --f46d04462f0e5fbf6004d2546023 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 1:44 PM, MorphemeAddict <= span dir=3D"ltr"><lytlesw@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:37 PM= , Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 1:09 PM, .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com> wrote:
ju'o so'i roi retsku .i ku'i ji'a sai= mi krefu retsku di'e .i fanva zo'oi should fu ma to mu'i zoi g= y. I should eat .gy. joi zoi gy. I should go to the gym .gy. to mabla me zo= zoi javni toi toi

"I'm sure it's been asked many times before; even so= , I ask it again: How does one translate "should" (e.g. "I s= hould eat", "I should go to the gym" (Damned "zoi"= rules))?

With gismu:
=

I'm a little unsure about the pr= oper Lojban word for what I mean here (selbri?), but it seems to me that us= ing "gismu" is overly specific. Similar for "attitudinal&quo= t; when "cmavo" would apply. Those two categories cover all the b= ases (since names can't do the job).=A0

I said gismu because that's what I used. IT= 's possible that other forms of selbri (eg. tanru, lujvo, etc.) would a= lso work, but the example I used was a gismu. The same reasoning applies to= the other example.

stevo

mi bilga lonu citka


Wit= h attitudinal (although I wouldn't be surprised if there's disagree= ment on this one):

mi citka.ei
=A0
--
mu'o mi= 'e .arpis.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.


--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai = ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
=

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+un= subscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/g= roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.



--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
--f46d04462f0e5fbf6004d2546023--