Received: from mail-pd0-f185.google.com ([209.85.192.185]:43826) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Utk82-0002gc-US; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:21 -0700 Received: by mail-pd0-f185.google.com with SMTP id t12sf1051508pdi.2 for ; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:x-ct-class:x-ct-score:x-ct-refid:x-ct-spam :x-authority-analysis:x-cm-score:message-id:date:from:organization :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=HD9Er7OJo6iZkmd++RFser6kJmVLASp87FbRhWoIIos=; b=tomj6yOoKASqsMcNoxnLOqt9LepfbFFMsVNuy/67k+LOQDu0SPiUPDXp/bRfuwAZhZ u/8XJarD4Ocaa6817QSOce25R6h6rNjvlx2BrdK6m6QOxaZSLUXgvwX7Kkk6r1/GUNts mWUyEfaplrux03vrwFU9hRGKV4BwDjxab7SstaJW067OLc3SFvTAYyVZgeDhi6t61JXa rm1ZLZ5OZw+0n+BvIMVkBfk1LuJN3NA8kL25eAWSkiIOvGqwUZJPQajQ+vNP/9dufbDG bw4Cjro74RwfbtiO80GBENVTTrCj5wB4upDI8r7GvoATyfQpKFrYKfoZYa64OD+WFsbF Zntg== X-Received: by 10.49.25.36 with SMTP id z4mr760310qef.6.1372708267907; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:07 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.106.195 with SMTP id gw3ls2344956qeb.64.gmail; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.224.86.200 with SMTP id t8mr28073028qal.0.1372708266487; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eastrmfepo201.cox.net (eastrmfepo201.cox.net. [68.230.241.216]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id s6si2776575qcy.0.2013.07.01.12.51.06 for ; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 12:51:06 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 68.230.241.216 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) client-ip=68.230.241.216; Received: from eastrmimpo210 ([68.230.241.225]) by eastrmfepo201.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.01.05.09 201-2260-151-124-20120717) with ESMTP id <20130701195106.DAYZ3846.eastrmfepo201.cox.net@eastrmimpo210> for ; Mon, 1 Jul 2013 15:51:06 -0400 Received: from [192.168.0.100] ([72.209.248.61]) by eastrmimpo210 with cox id v7r51l00B1LDWBL017r5o1; Mon, 01 Jul 2013 15:51:05 -0400 X-CT-Class: Clean X-CT-Score: 0.00 X-CT-RefID: str=0001.0A02020A.51D1DDA9.017C,ss=1,re=0.000,fgs=0 X-CT-Spam: 0 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=fILnK+me c=1 sm=1 a=z9jnGXjs1dxvEuWvIXKNSw==:17 a=YsUzL_8ObRgA:10 a=l_7UfLd_IbAA:10 a=xmHE3fpoGJwA:10 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=8YJikuA2AAAA:8 a=EEBAwD2ZNaIA:10 a=wGBaBHt0LL2n4Kh0DVcA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=dxBpO5_FDU0A:10 a=z9jnGXjs1dxvEuWvIXKNSw==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: <51D1DDA4.5030300@lojban.org> Date: Mon, 01 Jul 2013 15:51:00 -0400 From: "Bob LeChevalier, President and Founder - LLG" Organization: The Logical Language Group, Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:13.0) Gecko/20120614 Thunderbird/13.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Why {ea} is not allowed? References:

<2213721.HzcJNECb43@caracal> In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 68.230.241.216 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of lojbab@lojban.org) smtp.mail=lojbab@lojban.org Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / Sid wrote: > =E2=80=B9ea=E2=80=BA in Old English symbolized [=C3=A6=C9=91], not [ea]. = And the Middle English > =E2=80=B9ea=E2=80=BA symbolized /=C9=9B=CB=90/. > > What I find stranger is that "eu" is not a Lojban diphthong. "eu" is > fairly > common, occurring in Spanish at least of the six. It's a diphthong > in Basque > but not Lojban, which is why "auskalerik" is so spelled. > "euskalerik" would > have an extra syllable. /eu/ does not occur in Russian (Belarusian, > but not > Russian, has diphthongs ending in /u/) or English (it turns into > /iu/). The > other three I don't know. 1. Neither ea nor eu were in Loglan, and at the time we weren't=20 interested in making changes without a good reason. 2. Equally importantly, as Pierre noted, they are not found in modern=20 English. Nor are they found in Chinese, or Hindi or Arabic, as far as I=20 know. And since diphthongs don't appear in gismu anyway, expanding the=20 list was hardly important. 3. Finally, with regard to all of the diphthongs involving u, we had=20 noticed that they a) had a lot of variant pronunciations, and b)=20 sometimes produced especially difficult combinations, that some would=20 pronounce as diphthongs and others would make disyllables. (the worst=20 of these was "ui" especially after l, r, c, or s). Since Lojban's=20 audiovisual isomorphism is dependent on syllable counts, this would have=20 produced (and did produce in Loglan) variants in stress depending on=20 whether someone pronounced 1 or 2 syllables. The easiest solution was=20 to force all questionable diphthongs to ALWAYS be disyllables, and that=20 is how the apostrophe was born. lojbab --=20 Bob LeChevalier lojbab@lojban.org www.lojban.org President and Founder, The Logical Language Group, Inc. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.