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From: Michael Turniansky <mturniansky@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2015 23:25:56 -0400
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Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Trying my first translation ... a few questions.
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 Let me amplify that selpa'i was correct in picking up two points I missed.
 lo gercmo is a barker, not a bark.  The bark itself would be gerselcmo or
gercmosna.  And he is correct about needing a gi'e (or .i je bo) to break
up the ungrammatical double sentence.
                          --gejyspa


On Tue, Aug 25, 2015 at 8:46 PM, la .xabltos. <hobbletoe@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thank you both so much.  I really appreciate the feed back, and I will
> definitely think this all over.
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 25, 2015 at 1:59:42 PM UTC-4, la .xabltos. wrote:
>>
>> So, I have been studying for a few months now.  Most of that time, I read
>> through most of the Wave lessons, and the crash course, though mostly
>> through "Lojban for Beginners".  Recently, I started to go through some of
>> the "early reader" texts that I could find, as I think that that will help
>> me learn the basic grammar better as it won't be as complex.
>>
>> So now I am trying to translate an "early reader" book to Lojban.  I have
>> noticed that it really requires you to understand and think about the
>> grammar of the sentence more than I would normally do.  I am hoping that
>> this is a learned thing, and that it will be come easier as time passes, as
>> I think it was tripping me up initially.
>>
>> So, the name of the book is "The Puppy Who Lost his Bark".   Initially, I
>> thought that I needed to use "lost" as my selbri, and build the rest of the
>> sentence around that.  What I got was
>>
>> lo cityge'u ma cu cirko le ri gercmo
>>
>> Which I really knew was not right.  "ma" is completely out of place and
>> doesn't fit into the sentence structure.  Then it dawned on me that I was
>> dealing with a relative clause, and I think I got it right the second time
>> around.
>>
>> lo cityge'u poi ma kau cirko le ke'a gercmo
>>
>> I then move on into the book.  "Little Puppy likes to play, but loses
>> toys every day."
>>
>> .i lo cmalu cityge'u goi ko'a cu nelci le nu kelci ku ku'i ri cirko le
>> zilkei ti'u le ro djedi
>>
>> My question here (outside of hoping that I got it right), is "zilkei".
>> I understand it as a lujvo (zi'o kelci).  What I don't understand is why
>> that would be chosen over something like selkei (se kelci).  Can anyone
>> explain this choice?
>>
>> I've gone a bit farther, but don't want to run into any copyright blah,
>> blah, blah, so I'll stop here.
>>
>> Any notes, comments, corrections would be appreciated.
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
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<div dir=3D"ltr">=C2=A0Let me amplify that selpa&#39;i was correct in picki=
ng up two points I missed. =C2=A0lo gercmo is a barker, not a bark.=C2=A0 T=
he bark itself would be gerselcmo or gercmosna.=C2=A0 And he is correct abo=
ut needing a gi&#39;e (or .i je bo) to break up the ungrammatical double se=
ntence.<div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 --gejyspa</div><div>=C2=A0</div></div><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 25, 2015 at 8:=
46 PM, la .xabltos. <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hobbletoe@gmail=
.com" target=3D"_blank">hobbletoe@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><block=
quote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc=
 solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Thank you both so much.=C2=A0 I r=
eally appreciate the feed back, and I will definitely think this all over.=
=C2=A0<div><div class=3D"h5"><br><br>On Tuesday, August 25, 2015 at 1:59:42=
 PM UTC-4, la .xabltos. wrote:<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin:0;margin-left:0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><div>So, I have been studying for a few months now.=C2=A0 Most =
of that time, I read through most of the Wave lessons, and the crash course=
, though mostly through &quot;Lojban for Beginners&quot;.=C2=A0 Recently, I=
 started to go through some of the &quot;early reader&quot; texts that I co=
uld find, as I think that that will help me learn the basic grammar better =
as it won&#39;t be as complex.</div><div><br></div><div>So now I am trying =
to translate an &quot;early reader&quot; book to Lojban.=C2=A0 I have notic=
ed that it really requires you to understand and think about the grammar of=
 the sentence more than I would normally do.=C2=A0 I am hoping that this is=
 a learned thing, and that it will be come easier as time passes, as I thin=
k it was tripping me up initially.</div><div><br></div><div>So, the name of=
 the book is &quot;The Puppy Who Lost his Bark&quot;.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Initially=
, I thought that I needed to use &quot;lost&quot; as my selbri, and build t=
he rest of the sentence around that.=C2=A0 What I got was</div><div><br></d=
iv><div><font style=3D"background-color:rgb(204,204,204)">lo cityge&#39;u m=
a cu cirko le ri gercmo</font></div><div><br></div><div>Which I really knew=
 was not right.=C2=A0 &quot;ma&quot; is completely out of place and doesn&#=
39;t fit into the sentence structure.=C2=A0 Then it dawned on me that I was=
 dealing with a relative clause, and I think I got it right the second time=
 around.</div><div><br></div><div><font color=3D"#000000" style=3D"backgrou=
nd-color:rgb(204,204,204)">lo cityge&#39;u poi ma kau=C2=A0cirko le ke&#39;=
a gercmo</font></div><div><br></div><div>I then move on into the book.=C2=
=A0 &quot;Little Puppy likes to play, but loses toys every day.&quot;</div>=
<div><br></div><div><font style=3D"background-color:rgb(204,204,204)">.i lo=
 cmalu cityge&#39;u goi ko&#39;a cu nelci le nu kelci ku ku&#39;i ri cirko =
le zilkei ti&#39;u=C2=A0le ro djedi</font></div><div><br></div><div>My ques=
tion here (outside of hoping that I got it right), is &quot;<font style=3D"=
background-color:rgb(204,204,204)">zilkei</font>&quot;.=C2=A0 I understand =
it as a lujvo (<font style=3D"background-color:rgb(204,204,204)">zi&#39;o k=
elci</font>).=C2=A0 What I don&#39;t understand is why that would be chosen=
 over something like selkei (<font style=3D"background-color:rgb(204,204,20=
4)">se kelci</font>).=C2=A0 Can anyone explain this choice?</div><div><br><=
/div><div>I&#39;ve gone a bit farther, but don&#39;t want to run into any c=
opyright blah, blah, blah, so I&#39;ll stop here.</div><div><br></div><div>=
Any notes, comments, corrections would be appreciated.</div><div><br></div>=
<div>Thank you.</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div class=3D"HOE=
nZb"><div class=3D"h5">

<p></p>

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<p></p>

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