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Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 13:43:30 -0700
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Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Anyone there?
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From: Robin Lee Powell <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org>
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On Fri, Aug 20, 2004 at 06:30:10AM +1000, Tristan Mc Leay wrote:
> But that still brings up two issues: 
>
>  (1) my original point, that [i] vs [I] is not 
>      particularly well-attested amongst the world's 
>      languages. Spanish for instance doesn't have it. 
>      To the best of my understanding, langs that 
>      don't have both tend to have difficulty 
>      distinguishing them.

You've gone way beyond me now; ask the Founders.

>  (2) any non-lojban vowel (apart from [e] and [O], 
>      being acceptible alternatives for /E/ and /o/, 
>      yes?) can be used as a buffer, I thought. So if I
>      wanted, I could happily say rabn. as [rabn=]
>      or [rab2n] or [rabVn] or any other number of 
>      options.

I don't know enough about IPA or phonetics to completely follow this,
but I believe you're corroct.

> > > No, not at all. But the 'ee' in 'beet' is a
> > diphthong IMD (starting
> > > from something like [@] and ending at somewhere
> > like [i]). The 'i' in
> > > 'bit' is a short vowel. 
> > 
> > Wow.  That doesn't resemble my dialect even a little.
> 
> The best way to approach the phonetics of english
> dialects is with a clean slate. My dialect also has a
> just-about pure length distinction between say dad and
> mad, bud and barred, shed and shared, and less
> definitely bid and beard ([I:] and [I@] and various
> other similar sounds turn up as allophones of each
> other conditioned as much by randomness as other
> sounds).

Lost me compeletly.

> > Can you give me an example of a word with [I] in it?
> 
> Well, I suppose assuming short i is [I], then
> 'little'.

OK, so what's a word with long i in it, then, in your dialect?

> > I have difficulty imagining two sounds more easy to distinguish than
> > [i] and [I], so this is a really wierd discussion for me.
> 
> [2] and [a] are pretty distinct...

I have no idea what those are, or what your point is.  This is kind of
off-topic for the beginner's list now, don't you think?

-Robin

-- 
http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** http://www.lojban.org/
Reason #237 To Learn Lojban: "Homonyms: Their Grate!"