From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Dec 01 06:22:13 2006 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:22:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gq9HI-0002Ch-Ub for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:22:13 -0800 Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.184.237]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gq9HE-0002CW-0f for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:22:12 -0800 Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i11so970833wra for ; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:22:06 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=faVA3NxVjx1NeQcVRgTrG5bDCtRHTpf6Lt38voExdOTv2XUwwpIobG0t+wZqzzPpeMfHoO+GOj8SDTtcbztRKznl9AeYwnwERsQG996ETseY0IdXc6OH4mAa48bAWkdgI4kZfLzl9qr0m5OQuhKiIBoXYwEB9Rsp4CXCmkdyl1o= Received: by 10.90.68.15 with SMTP id q15mr5081063aga.1164982926695; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:22:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.104.9 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Dec 2006 06:22:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2006 10:22:06 -0400 From: Betsemes To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: A learning idea..... and my own attempt to do it. In-Reply-To: <456F7EA8.4050708@phma.optus.nu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <456F7EA8.4050708@phma.optus.nu> X-Spam-Score: -2.6 (--) X-archive-position: 3735 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: betsemes@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 11/30/06, Pierre Abbat wrote: > Betsemes wrote: > li'o > > "Around two weeks ago, I got my eighth sponsored child; a filipino > > little girl who lives on Manila city." > > > > lojban translation: > > zi lo jeftu be li re mi [pu] co'a pidversra lo mi bimoi be lo'i verba > > be'o ne lo se natmrfilipino ke cmalu. nixli poi xabju lo tcadu pe me'e > > la'o py. Manila .py. > > > > pidversra: x1=s1 helps/donates to/supports poor child x2=s2=v1=p1 by > > means x3=s4, child is of age x4=v2 and lacking in > > possessions/properties x5=p2 > > Where did s3 go? It's lo ka pindi, I surmise. Yes. > > So there is no type 4 fu'ivla for "Filipino". I think there should be > > one. I also wrote each pause explicitly, please, tell me whether they > > are OK and whether there should be another one. I think the "pu" is > > not necesary from the Lojban standpoint, but I inserted it on brackets > > to state where I think it should be. > > {pu} isn't necessary grammatically, but without it, the sentence could > just as easily mean "About two weeks from now, I will...". Point taken. > The translation is wordy. I'd say something more like this: > zi lo jeftu be li re mi pu co'a pidversra le mi bimoi verba no'u le > cmalu ke filpino nixli poi xabju la mainilyd. poi tcadu > > * {le} both times because you know who the child is. > * {filpino} and {pilpino} are, as xorxes said, both well-formed fu'ivla. > Which is better is subject to discussion. Tagalog is poor in fricatives > and has no "f", but foreign words in Filipino may have it. Currently the > name of the islands is "Pilipinas", but that of the language is "Filipino". As I stated on another email, I prefer {pilpino}, but that's my personal preference. > * Is the child small for a child or for a Philippine child? It's a six years old little girl. In our culture, a girl could be 15 or 16 years old who could be as tall as adults. So if x3 is our culture, then we can call {cmalu nixli} a 6yo girl. nixli x1 is a girl [young female person] of age x2 immature by standard x3 > * "d" in {mainilyd} because it's named for the nilad flower. So why {mainilyd} and not {manilyd}? Is there any {cmevla} formation rule I'm overlooking? > * {no'u} the first time because otherwise she would be your eighth > Filipina. {poi} the second to distinguish the city from the bay, though > humans don't normally inhabit bays. Hmmm, you seem to be knowledgeable about the Philippines, I didn't know that there is a Manila Bay. She is actually my first Filipina.