From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Jan 16 19:44:36 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:44:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H71j1-0008BN-SQ for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:44:36 -0800 Received: from phma.optus.nu ([166.82.175.165] helo=ixazon.dynip.com) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H71iy-0008B6-Bg for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:44:35 -0800 Received: from chausie (unknown [192.168.7.4]) by ixazon.dynip.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7125CE58C for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:44:14 -0500 (EST) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Lojban as Barsoomian: Intro Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:41:43 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <8A2E2AB9-C4C8-470B-9B81-CA43F4515285@mindspring.com> In-Reply-To: <8A2E2AB9-C4C8-470B-9B81-CA43F4515285@mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ansi_x3.4-1968" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701162241.44308.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Spam-Score: -2.2 X-Spam-Score-Int: -21 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-archive-position: 3889 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: phma@phma.optus.nu Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Tuesday 16 January 2007 20:31, Cortesi wrote: > Problem One: "Princess" > > Problem one is what to call the Princess in a vocative. At more than > one point someone addresses her formally, {coi [Princess]}... My best > shot so far is a simple tanru, > > noble type-of ruler type-of daughter > > nobli turni tixnu > > coi noltruti'u... > > I got all tangled up in whether she's a {nobli je turni} type of > daughter or possibly a daughter OF a ruler {nobli tixnu pe la turni}. > But any such complication makes the lujvo longer and less easy to > rattle off in dialog. {noltruti'u} is fine. We already have {noltruni'u}, used for the Queen in Alice. You may want to use some attitudinals such as {io} and {ga'i}. > I'm unhappy that the tanru doesn't carry any of the connotations of > the English word--the sense of unearned privilege; the high social > value; the expectation of future power, etc. But hey, that's the > translation game. Words get connotations by being used in contexts. "Chad" has quite a different connotation now, after the disputed election, than it did when I was typing my first programs on punched cards. The denotation is still the same. Pierre