From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Mar 19 09:54:18 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HTL7f-0007c8-Mg for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:16 -0700 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.187]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HTL7Z-0007bt-OQ for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:15 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id c31so1983192nfb for ; Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=sJcvx8ZHDBGhbnV0iWJ8TKIhHEa/DTLBmuRt7DTBvk/h0lMORQ17BSk+zd4gwVh4EW7rQzrLUkODbKNtQW0pQOwcav3R324Rf2oqbbpFJv880Kc6H/K6Jdq5TMpdGcYEeU7BhovQPgcI7A9bM3zi+tneHLN6BrXdhIYvMU2oM2s= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=U0xNCxfYM1QgMLzydMOnsrdMLsgf4Mk5NmGdkycDFkYvcgmzPhxpRwk6ogSBkebHXFbDhk5lsqqpEREpVg04ugIrQfjqA/7M9WnbVKGJ+qc93w7OTdSgiD1wKZUZu2UyjryqweXUXHOnM38G6X+irRgFA5FTucGxdsYgZqY4lQY= Received: by 10.78.139.1 with SMTP id m1mr2511378hud.1174323247887; Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.50.10 with HTTP; Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:54:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <23dc8c770703190954q6b43657ase7de3cc987e7fea2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2007 16:54:07 +0000 From: "Karl Naylor" To: Lojban-beginners Subject: [lojban-beginners] More tense confusion MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Score-Int: -25 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-archive-position: 4178 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: karl.org@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners coi rodo The tense system is really confusing me. Taken from the Reference Grammar: --- subordinate: X TENSE le nu Y afterthought coordinate: Y .i+TENSE+bo X forethought coordinate: TENSE+gi X gi Y --- Now, according to that table, the following should be equivalent: a) mi klama le zarci pu le nu mi klama le zdani b) mi klama le zdani .ipubo my klama le zarci c) pugi mi klama le zarci gi mi klama le zdani (c) is identical to: 16.6) pugi mi klama le zarci gi mi klama le zdani [past] I go-to the market [,] I go-to the house. Before I go to the market, I go to the house. However, based on Section 12, I would translate (a) as "I go to the market before I go to the house", which is the opposite of this. So what has gone wrong? By analogy with the behavior of {gu}...{gi}, I'm inclined to think that the table up there is correct, is that right? mu'o mi'e .karl.