From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Apr 12 10:19:04 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:19:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Hc2wp-0004LK-HE for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:19:03 -0700 Received: from web88009.mail.re2.yahoo.com ([206.190.37.196]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Hc2wl-0004LA-FM for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:19:03 -0700 Received: (qmail 40114 invoked by uid 60001); 12 Apr 2007 17:18:52 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=jVDEjGe/VDpISyAYWE9PV4zZCO1dKJ7XDbKljJXHmn3LyeRdCgCOjTnq0WtqHYxVI/9BEZOKPBztyWPsgTP6QmSUyMeZNVA+5BrQgyhDFw1coCGkmGHW3z3bwaAOBRHLsbzOh5fn2NQMuoYuziQ0b0Fr6HCmPGzaJAyCmOFo8k0=; X-YMail-OSG: mWT9MXoVM1khomSQWqAhOA0zhikCHkSBASvAJUngB0pOtH2_3rtR2jM.d_pV.cd4zAJ2SQw1CaptDiV46qrk6H3N8Q-- Received: from [74.96.97.233] by web88009.mail.re2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:18:52 PDT Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:18:52 -0700 (PDT) From: ANDREW PIEKARSKI Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Now what? To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-828449446-1176398332=:39322" Message-ID: <398676.39322.qm@web88009.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Spam-Score: -0.5 X-Spam-Score-Int: -4 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 4234 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: totus@rogers.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners --0-828449446-1176398332=:39322 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii Great! Thanks to your collective efforts, I think I now understand why le, lo and la kandygu'e can be ok.........however, what about "la kadnygug. cu lamji la mergug" ? Surely "kadnygug" is not valid. Doesn't CLL state that a CVC rafsi cannot be at the end of a word? - Andrew ----- Original Message ---- From: "komfo,amonan" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2007 11:33:21 AM Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Now what? On 4/12/07, ANDREW PIEKARSKI wrote: But in the real world, unless I am writing about alternate universes, I have only one specific Canada in mind - so surely it must be "le kadnygu'e"? Not quite. In the sentence I used before (lo kadnygu'e cu lamji lo mergu'e), the sense of 'Canada' is quite clear. But imagine someone leaving Canada & returning years later, finding it changed, and saying, "The Canada I remember has ceased to exist." I would go with le there: le kadnygu'e poi mi morji fi ke'a cu pu co'u zasti In the real world, Canada is what it is. But in people's minds, there are different Canadas. You could use 'la' there too. As far as "la kadnygu'e" is concerned, "kadnygu'e" would have to be a name, but section 4.8 of the CLL says "Names may have almost any form, but always end in a consonant". So how can it be acceptable? Take a look at 6:2.6 -2.11. la/lai/la'i can take a selbri as well as a cmene. But a cmene can only take la/lai/la'i, whereas a selbri can take any of the gadri (lo, le, la, loi, &c.). The restriction is one-way. mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan --0-828449446-1176398332=:39322 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ascii
Great!  Thanks to your collective efforts, I think I now understand why le, lo and la kandygu'e can be ok.........however, what about  "la kadnygug. cu lamji la mergug" ? Surely "kadnygug" is not valid.  Doesn't CLL state that a CVC rafsi cannot be at the end of a word?
 
- Andrew

----- Original Message ----
From: "komfo,amonan" <komfoamonan@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2007 11:33:21 AM
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Now what?

On 4/12/07, ANDREW PIEKARSKI <totus@rogers.com> wrote:
But in the real world, unless I am writing about alternate universes, I have only one specific Canada in mind - so surely it must be "le kadnygu'e"?

Not quite. In the sentence I used before (lo kadnygu'e cu lamji lo mergu'e), the sense of 'Canada' is quite clear. But imagine someone leaving Canada & returning years later, finding it changed, and saying, "The Canada I remember has ceased to exist." I would go with le there:

le kadnygu'e poi mi morji fi ke'a cu pu co'u zasti

In the real world, Canada is what it is. But in people's minds, there are different Canadas. You could use 'la' there too.

As far as "la kadnygu'e" is concerned, "kadnygu'e" would have to be a name, but section 4.8 of the CLL says "Names may have almost any form, but always end in a consonant".  So how can it be acceptable?

Take a look at 6:2.6 -2.11. la/lai/la'i can take a selbri as well as a cmene. But a cmene can only take la/lai/la'i, whereas a selbri can take any of the gadri (lo, le, la, loi, &c.). The restriction is one-way.

mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan



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