From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Jun 21 19:23:40 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I1YoF-0000Gy-LW for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:40 -0700 Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.162.238]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1I1YoC-0000Gk-NM for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:39 -0700 Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id n1so799741nzf for ; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=SHPX/fR/ljwvjkkB9Lee7Z9/5JcljZcsEvyNJB1kJVPTlf/oA/jumwFT8aK5A5UM3bj/rMvRp7dxvWvB+22VsX31cf03vEwewiJq49TdSyeanwjBgmtogCBP6CbeD/GXuoUA+0GqxzuqJGgzSzYYXs7XYEh6VxZmrzmdaHmT1NI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=KEglh1vgQPjTbfqgZS8lg9H/sSEZ/fL3m/MuYRJ5sfFhKIZBJVeObezTOb5cLu4ZYIaIgjZ4iUHlnr9mhyeqm/WnR7QJqT7dOdMDwvKEYipOu0/yvYMr1yXB84UXXsL10ZIDz1xPpZtfa68vwUOEyJgQxJasS6d39TMwUduQivo= Received: by 10.65.251.17 with SMTP id d17mr4887588qbs.1182479015407; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.191.16 with HTTP; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 19:23:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <702226df0706211923h6aec083dp3c583b70f676571f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:23:35 -0600 From: "Jon \"Top Hat\" Jones" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: online e-learning In-Reply-To: <1182448250.467aba7ac6ddc@ssl0.ovh.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_100459_12200515.1182479015360" References: <1182038545.46747a1157281@ssl0.ovh.net> <411a52d90706170320s68eaaf6ar44e1d6bfe4b8f008@mail.gmail.com> <702226df0706202359o4646022dl3aac5e9da22ac8b2@mail.gmail.com> <702226df0706210200jee6baf8n673662a1f2291a95@mail.gmail.com> <1182448250.467aba7ac6ddc@ssl0.ovh.net> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5107 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: eyeonus@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners ------=_Part_100459_12200515.1182479015360 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On 6/21/07, m.kornig@sondal.net wrote: > > Selon "Jon \\Top Hat\\ Jones" : > > > > I've been checking it out, and I've only just started, but I noticed > that > > > your mp3 for vo cuts off early- I only hear the very beginning of the > 'o'. > > Jon, I've just double-checked the mp3 files on my site: > I can't hear anything particular with the vowels in > words like {vo}, {coi} and {co'o}. These files aren't > smaller (than those for other words) and the recordings > don't seem to "cut off early". > > I've taken great care though not to pronounce the {o} > as a diphthong. Could this be the reason why you think > something is missing? It's entirely possible that it's a problem on my end- it may be that whatever firefox program does the playback on my box cuts off the end. Even if that's true, there's really not much I could do about it. This also happens to me for the cmene in 1.3- {djein} sounds like {djei}, and so on. This could be easily fixed if you edited the files to put a longer silence at the end, so you would say, for example, {..djein....}, then, the cut-off I experience wouldn't matter, since it cut off silence. > > As I said on a different thread, I recorded myself with the basic > numbers > > > and sounds of Lojban, I made sure they have a decent pause before and > after > > > so as not to be cut off on playback, I'll send them to you if you'd > like. > > > > > > -- > > > mu'o mi'e .topy'at. > > > > > > .i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu > > > > > > The same thing with 'coi' and 'co'o'- they both sound like 'co'. > > So you don't hear the diphthong in {coi}? That's strange. > I can hear it very clearly though on my system. Again, it's because of the cut-off effect I experienced, not due to lack of pronunciation on your part. Jon, I thank you a lot for your feedback and for your > recordings which I have (eventually) been able to listen to. > Unfortunately, they all have quite some background noise. > (Maybe a noisy environment? Sometimes it helps to switch > off the loudspeakers while recording...). I think I had the mic gain a little high when I recorded those- I have my speakers fairly quiet, so I didn't notice the background noise on playback. I actually had to turn the volume up to double it's normal value. I'll have to fix that.... Do you think (you Jon and the others) learners would > appreciate listening to these recordings nevertheless > (maybe along with my own)? I think it would be good to have sound samples of the more common sayings and the individual sounds of le le'uste from as many different people as possible- for the dual purpose of helping to train beginners by enabling them to hear the sounds, and to hear the range that people from different cultures use for the same sounds. Martin > > > > -- mu'o mi'e .topy'at. .i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu ------=_Part_100459_12200515.1182479015360 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On 6/21/07, m.kornig@sondal.net <m.kornig@sondal.net> wrote:
Selon "Jon \\Top Hat\\ Jones" <eyeonus@gmail.com>:

> > I've been checking it out, and I've only just started, but I noticed that
> > your mp3 for vo cuts off early- I only hear the very beginning of the 'o'.

Jon, I've just double-checked the mp3 files on my site:
I can't hear anything particular with the vowels in
words like {vo}, {coi} and {co'o}. These files aren't
smaller (than those for other words) and the recordings
don't seem to "cut off early".

I've taken great care though not to pronounce the {o}
as a diphthong. Could this be the reason why you think
something is missing?

It's entirely possible that it's a problem on my end- it may be that whatever firefox program does the playback on my box cuts off the end. Even if that's true, there's really not much I could do about it. This also happens to me for the cmene in 1.3- {djein} sounds like {djei}, and so on. This could be easily fixed if you edited the files to put a longer silence at the end, so you would say, for example, {..djein....}, then, the cut-off I experience wouldn't matter, since it cut off silence.

> > As I said on a different thread, I recorded myself with the basic numbers
> > and sounds of Lojban, I made sure they have a decent pause before and after
> > so as not to be cut off on playback, I'll send them to you if you'd like.
> >
> > --
> > mu'o mi'e .topy'at.
> >
> > .i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu
>
>
> The same thing with 'coi' and 'co'o'- they both sound like 'co'.

So you don't hear the diphthong in {coi}? That's strange.
I can hear it very clearly though on my system.

Again, it's because of the cut-off effect I experienced, not due to lack of pronunciation on your part.
 

Jon, I thank you a lot for your feedback and for your
recordings which I have (eventually) been able to listen to.
Unfortunately, they all have quite some background noise.
(Maybe a noisy environment? Sometimes it helps to switch
off the loudspeakers while recording...).

I think I had the mic gain a little high when I recorded those- I have my speakers fairly quiet, so I didn't notice the background noise on playback. I actually had to turn the volume up to double it's normal value. I'll have to fix that....

Do you think (you Jon and the others) learners would
appreciate listening to these recordings nevertheless
(maybe along with my own)?

I think it would be good to have sound samples of the more common sayings and the individual sounds of le le'uste from as many different people as possible- for the dual purpose of helping to train beginners by enabling them to hear the sounds, and to hear the range that people from different cultures use for the same sounds.
 

Martin






--
mu'o mi'e .topy'at.

.i.a'o.e'e ko klama le bende pe denpa bu ------=_Part_100459_12200515.1182479015360--