From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Aug 10 05:54:58 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IJU13-0003s5-7u for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:58 -0700 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.186]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IJU0w-0003rv-8f for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:56 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 4so217085nfv for ; Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=FVmojf1AePvSve/YkzAZ+j1WWwwUDcq6TTSP4X0g4yNbWsOK9Z7Xwu4xfBM99TVgcwuJKJRnMfm83Ds4m7bymTY8skxUf5zlgBz2t/IPMA0N8eTs2AFVyoCNjY8dNUx3WprGADUykDWp+6LJYtX/Mpsh2AaWV2Di2d9qTz5kuzI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ot0SCo15g6gAoSI8qVotLJYKIrQh6v+8PAXInolY/m9peiClzy16NYcyyj2pPFnHVt4wc3K4VjlFMfcMh+BolB8jUFJwQB72bFZ2lRXpTjMVBKEvGI/dpznr/Nwvin8YdTZ9bClRQxyav8x2EB89EKj5AFz2u0bwYrTHXBzrFIY= Received: by 10.86.4.2 with SMTP id 2mr1970179fgd.1186750488141; Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.86.13 with HTTP; Fri, 10 Aug 2007 05:54:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <925d17560708100554m6232d274ua912df386fd715b7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 09:54:48 -0300 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: anti-Zipfian gismu rant In-Reply-To: <398993.4184.qm@web56403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <46BBDB4D.6020401@lojban.org> <398993.4184.qm@web56403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5329 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 8/10/07, Nathaniel Krause wrote: > Can someone clarify Lojban's semantic philosophy in this regard? I was under > the impression that for something to be a ro'erbroda it must by definition > be an instance of a brode broda and, more broadly, an instance of a broda. > Is the statement {lo'e ro'erbroda na broda} logically contradictory? Not really, there is no strict connection between {brode broda} and {ro'erbroda}. In particular the place structure of {brode broda} is identical to the place structure of {broda}, whereas the place structure of {ro'erbroda} is independent and usually different from that of {broda}. There are many informal relationships, for example you can more or less be certain of what the place structure of {ro'ergau} is just based on the place structures of brode and gasnu, but there are no fixed and absolute rules. Having said that, the expected and normal outcome is that a ro'erbroda will indeed be a kind of broda, but it doesn't always work. mu'o mi'e xorxes