From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Wed Oct 17 14:47:11 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Wed, 17 Oct 2007 14:47:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IiGjO-0002xc-PC for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Wed, 17 Oct 2007 14:47:10 -0700 Received: from phma.optus.nu ([166.82.175.165] helo=ixazon.dynip.com) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IiGjM-0002xT-Ds for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Wed, 17 Oct 2007 14:47:10 -0700 Received: from chausie (unknown [192.168.7.4]) by ixazon.dynip.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04C0DCE58C for ; Wed, 17 Oct 2007 17:47:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Abbat To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Why not a new LfB text? Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 17:47:01 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <559018.59883.qm@web88003.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <925d17560710171409k15ea657dve5fdc1096cd683fd@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <925d17560710171409k15ea657dve5fdc1096cd683fd@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200710171747.01720.phma@phma.optus.nu> X-Spam-Score: 0.1 X-Spam-Score-Int: 1 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5492 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: phma@phma.optus.nu Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Wednesday 17 October 2007 17:09, Jorge Llambías wrote: > The real difference is actually more subtle and has to do with default > quantifiers: xorlo has none. It's not even possible to explain the > difference without using {lo broda} in a sentence, because outer > quantifiers only make sense in the context of a sentence. They don't mean > much by themselves in an isolated sumti. One of the sentences that motivated xorlo is "I need a doctor." Before xorlo, {mi nitcu lo mikce} is equivalent to {da poi mikce zo'u mi nitcu da}, "there exists a doctor whom I need". With xorlo, you can say "I need a doctor" without implying that you need a particular doctor but don't know which one. (If you did know, you'd say {le}.) But how do I say "I need three oranges"? {mi nitcu ci najnimre} does mean that there are three oranges that I need, but I could have any three oranges and be satisfied. Also, what's the place structure of {xorlo}? Pierre