From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Oct 25 09:45:16 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Il5pb-0002FW-Pt for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:16 -0700 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.184]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Il5pV-0002E7-NJ for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:15 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 4so455205nfv for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=0GNZ96RzChWAqDKxUeC+qalL/Uj1VssUrkDO0F90cmM=; b=oMeR5KOIzJ3ioyL9+xUdFSetJ7uGi6Lm/3eoozcWnrBipLgGl5JG970+a1u2B6d3HOYOrRSt/EDBWLetAodR3r7+edD/bPJd8ORpc5SfmUB3wUCiRwOQ/gNnILZL3iDhn47eSS9UMMJbqGmp8CwbnL4cUAMMFvKB04GHyVI4f0w= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=FGlQHWlb1HPf/gnBfQVp5fX86FBU8hDv6Jas2h33bPzxXyYIbQCgyVSEQsK3i9ncrYpe/KjR1VaOm7QaFbGuMztgIHn8CPKtlghgtj0BFaAdfh0sakV60NVyzT5AC0QfFUixMGmb4enns4arC1N6JuM2NNiGwh4FJuVTTZ/tMmo= Received: by 10.86.70.8 with SMTP id s8mr1471649fga.1193330703159; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.86.13 with HTTP; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:45:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <925d17560710250945w2c71ced7l165d89537f416699@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 13:45:03 -0300 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: ku before fa'u (was: Re: lo mlatu lo gerku ma kau frica) In-Reply-To: <4720AC9E.2090208@perpetuum-immobile.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <47239A9C@webmail.bcpl.net> <4720AC9E.2090208@perpetuum-immobile.de> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5620 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 10/25/07, Timo Paulssen wrote: > turnip wrote: > > (note: the ku is not grammatically necessary, but jboski doesn't like it > > without it) > > this is not correct. the ku is needed, because fa'u is of selma'o JOI, > which means it can connect either brivla together or sumti. The (currently) official parser does require {ku} there, but it is not actually needed for unambiguous parsing. > this has something to do with the type of grammar, that it has to be > able to identify what to join with one token of read-ahead or something > similar. Right, but Lojban grammar is not, in general, parsable with one token lookahead. The official parser deals with this with a preparsing stage where it handles numbers and other stuff. Since Lojban grammar is not and cannot be LALR(1), it doesn't make much sense to make the {ku} obligatory in that context, and parsers such as camxes don't require it. mu'o mi'e xorxes