From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Dec 21 07:10:25 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:10:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J5jW3-0007bc-Nd for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:10:24 -0800 Received: from rv-out-0910.google.com ([209.85.198.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J5jVp-0007YT-Sd for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:10:23 -0800 Received: by rv-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b22so260208rvf.46 for ; Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:09:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=MXKZyrY10/NojnlfspPlqiw6yy9z2QTPkflIOXS9RQA=; b=w0WqMpRRSZurghgM1LMQuXExBn2xP15PuDXG7odLfT55jCbrCS+QXcGAhJ+77GICNYrPjdSi8vlN3xV8dRbJsEebgFZ9vZXggw+bC6ywji1iqsgXgnqFCsTdw1zGs5yVzGkAFjOSJAMTlQ0ffYdIuccew0t6MAyqP7lEIg7WYXw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=UQueNao+AMrvQK33TeyM0O/Q4tPmbnq8ZnjfkUzr8uoBewa4cDIjaeOvgZIJJPwAOtmH+2uJozqdoWwjMpskcpeZUAVTfQxPbN7sqnCfN1IG9XQOKQU1lJ56tQQCYg/3vn9UbssD9MNB0y+ATmU9p4WTYthWXMpNC1QutBvTHlM= Received: by 10.140.133.10 with SMTP id g10mr794722rvd.170.1198249796933; Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:09:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.140.202.21 with HTTP; Fri, 21 Dec 2007 07:09:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <96f789a60712210709h48697821jfaa101180b1e688@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 10:09:56 -0500 From: "Michael Turniansky" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: lo question In-Reply-To: <925d17560712210637mea1a698w69ceae2900c609cf@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_540_20467895.1198249796925" References: <737b61f30712202126p40d516f0ha7cc0af582587332@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560712210637mea1a698w69ceae2900c609cf@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 2 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: mturniansky@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners ------=_Part_540_20467895.1198249796925 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline While we're on the topic of qualified sumti, I was wondering the following= : If I say "ci gerku cu citka lo cirla spisa poi bunda li bi - " 3 dogs ate 8 pounds of cheese", does this imply they EACH ate that amount, or they did as a group? My suspicion is that it means each, and that the way to say they at it as a group would be loi/lei ci gerku etc. (refgram chapter 6, section 3) . Is my understanding correct? (Can I also assume that's true o= f any PA, icluding "ro", etc.?) --gejyspa On Dec 21, 2007 9:37 AM, Jorge Llamb=EDas wrote: > On Dec 21, 2007 2:26 AM, Chris Capel wrote: > > So does {re lo ci mensi pe mi} entail that I have only three sisters? > > Change {pe} to {be} to make sure we're talking about your sisters, > and not just sisters in some way related to you. > > It means there are only three sisters of yours in the universe of > discourse. Wthout any further context, I would take that to mean > that you have only three sisters. > > But let's say you are on vacation with some friends and three of > your four sisters and you tell one of them: > > re lo ci mensi be mi ba xruti klama lo zdani ca le bavlamdei > Two of my three sisters are going back home tomorrow. > > I don't think you are thereby denying that you have a fourth sister > that is not at all relevant in this discourse. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > > ------=_Part_540_20467895.1198249796925 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline  While we're on the topic of qualified sumti, I was wondering the = following:

  If I say "ci gerku cu citka lo cirla spisa po= i bunda li bi - " 3 dogs ate 8 pounds of cheese", does this imply= they EACH ate that amount, or they did as a group?  My suspicion is t= hat it means  each, and that the way to say they at it as a group woul= d be loi/lei ci  gerku etc. (refgram chapter 6, section 3) .  Is = my understanding correct? (Can I also assume that's true of any PA, icl= uding "ro", etc.?)

            = --gejyspa


On Dec 21, 2007 9:37 AM, Jo= rge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail= .com> wrote:
On Dec 21, 2007 2:26 AM, Chris Capel <pdf23ds@gmail.com> wrote:
> So does {re lo ci mensi pe mi} = entail that I have only three sisters?

Change {pe} to {be} to make s= ure we're talking about your sisters,
and not just sisters in some way related to you.

It means there = are only three sisters of yours in the universe of
discourse. Wthout any= further context, I would take that to mean
that you have only three sis= ters.

But let's say you are on vacation with some friends and three o= f
your four sisters and you tell one of them:

 re lo ci men= si be mi ba xruti klama lo zdani ca le bavlamdei
 Two of my three = sisters are going back home tomorrow.

I don't think you are thereby denying that you have a fourth si= ster
that is not at all relevant in this discourse.

mu'o mi&#= 39;e xorxes




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