From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Apr 01 08:48:55 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Tue, 01 Apr 2008 08:48:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1JgijG-0007eW-An for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 08:48:54 -0700 Received: from fk-out-0910.google.com ([209.85.128.184]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Jgij8-0007Sl-3F for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 08:48:53 -0700 Received: by fk-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 18so3158544fkq.2 for ; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 08:48:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=J4suc2L05p3F5m4iibGD4qCVZuKoeMufPGDB09jK3Nc=; b=QgduUMEuYyeZMXY/LLFqZBTOBWoP90E84kFagb0X+PAvqsNBSf0pFV/fsa9poGThyMdyRACKkzIYtmWU8fIZmdh5I65U3oTCK5iG5zH3uE/tBk2AH+En0I5GKHXHkf6u5RR69euPUDWCF6QGgQqCqNw1ZBDBUHhK/FWnQ1n1FXw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ZjKx9kKtMgfUeucbhI3QxudDMc05RHXKhdWE1WlSdN+694qoB3Ekjj3FI+k1HcS07PEVZXOVO5Upm8cJUjeYX+M/oFRa6AFPjHiOur1tGW7+6Jy9dRg4TRn8BlkyCmGrYVheOP0WZum1XnenGi6QqufDlf3KABytCoDfAklunro= Received: by 10.82.161.19 with SMTP id j19mr20735705bue.12.1207064919198; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 08:48:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.33.18 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Apr 2008 08:48:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <925d17560804010848o1805477mffd4263d23bde906@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2008 12:48:39 -0300 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: zo bo In-Reply-To: <2f91285f0804010829x792696efrb909039ab4e476a3@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis Content-Disposition: inline References: <2f91285f0803310712u446302b6j9a3b70fe3f68091c@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0803311148p417ecf63k11d54ffc589b18c@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560803311201x1190fa3j788d108a5c8e16bb@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0803311529w7550b697r3e98191ad129377c@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560803311701n7fe0ef4bgd5585529580cfc82@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0804010045l54aa4d21q5c56697fafc458e2@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560804010602u2dd4a6bek5876e5f6808c3310@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0804010710x33ec6a3ak5218856e8ba9bad1@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560804010732s789875cob48694bd7f4b8e0f@mail.gmail.com> <2f91285f0804010829x792696efrb909039ab4e476a3@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 424 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 4/1/08, Vid Sintef wrote: > On Tue, Apr 1, 2008 at 4:32 PM, Jorge Llambías wrote: > > For pu, ca, ba you can always make the relationship explicit like this: > > > > broda .i pu bo brode -> lo nu brode cu purci lo nu broda > > broda .i ca bo brode -> lo nu brode cu cabna lo nu broda > > broda .i ba bo brode -> lo nu brode cu balvi lo nu broda > > > > For {nau}, I would expect some selbri to express the nau-relationship: > > > > broda .i nau bo brode -> lo nu brode cu nau zei co'e lo nu broda > > > > but I'm not sure what that relationship would be. > > My example has {pu} in relation to {nau}. So: > > pu broda .i nau bo brode -> lo nu broda cu nau purci lo nu brode (or, > lo nu broda cu purci lo nu nau brode) But won't {lo nu nelci} always remain in the past of {lo nu prami}, not just right now? And the fact that right now they are in the purci relationship with one another doesn't tell us which one of the two (if any) is happening right now. In any case, I wasn't really asking for a rephrasing, but for a selbri such that {nau} = {fi'o xxxxx}. Once we have that selbri, and assuming it has two arguments, we know how {nau} behaves as a connective. mu'o mi'e xorxes