From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sat Oct 04 10:37:54 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sat, 04 Oct 2008 10:37:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KmB4k-0004A1-RB for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 10:37:54 -0700 Received: from ag-out-0708.google.com ([72.14.246.251]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KmB4g-00049g-VB for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 10:37:54 -0700 Received: by ag-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id 23so1744512agd.7 for ; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 10:37:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=IXSJ+ZE2Fw6lRlSh9iWUqsQAVbch0MOxO3mF5fWIeMQ=; b=uz2dopsF3i7opSRGBScGsB4m3ks2VUq2Z1Ex9CWHqO56RUS33VJHDabEG8bhpbaZTS 7X9ScwclbNuwPnFF7TYlvzgi6F4ozgnIVHJ8u/Y8OzVVsw1QJfbaTsBG0DjkPLG3ALDR EAqtYIf2PeUe/2nUkMsMmKKVwjtTAUbpVjJ/I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=rVyZV6qnkRrW8zz9NHMaNahmVwdbiW/UQCEck87+LFUsg1nmz32tAUxIMoUbh0Q/6Q OgFT7wXh1EELuNJbjfEG0uklrBtK0YUQfGjqruTihJYe/6ty5f0aweQSExPkEyOZXgpW cx5AYJ9q2aKINLIgXlrDL7ZKQTwTXMXbKgr7g= Received: by 10.90.100.20 with SMTP id x20mr3115071agb.85.1223141869648; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 10:37:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.82.9 with HTTP; Sat, 4 Oct 2008 10:37:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <95b2fb130810041037y20dbf0f5jc29dd95a5947514c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 12:37:49 -0500 From: "H. Felton" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: User interfacing in Lojban.. In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: X-Spam-Score: -0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 913 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: fagricipni@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On 10/4/08, Mark wrote: > I was thinking recently about how a user interface in Lojban would be > labelled, and I came up a bit of a blank, because I can't see how a command > is presented (as opposed to commanded) in lojban.. > In a typical real UI there are three things a button can say: > 1) What the user does by pressing it ("Accept", "Dismiss") > 2) What the computer does when the user presses it ("Apply", "Search") > 3) What the user notionally communicates by pressing it ("OK") > For 2), for instance, you can't just say "Sisku" on the button, as that (as > I understand it) means "Look, a search/something searches!" which makes no > sense in context. Would the button read "ko sisku" ("Hey you, Search!")? > It feels a bit weird to me, but would it to a lojbanistanian? Actually in English the phrase; eg, "Find Next", is actually already grammatically an imperative; and at least in my high school English textbooks, it is claimed that English imperatives already have the implied subject of "you". So, the only "oddness" that I see is the "subject" has to be explicitly given in Lojban. > 1) I have no idea how to do. For Accept - "mi fitytu'i"? I think that will work; the user is "entering" a statement that means "I Accept (elided)". Indeed, in English the usage "Accept" is not strictly grammatically correct ; "Accept" should be interpreted as a imperative to the computer, not as a _description_ of one's own "action". However, like "daylight savings time", instead of the more correct "daylight saving time", the "Accept" problem _in English_ is a case where usage has overridden strict grammatical correctness. > 3), at least, is fairly clear - "je'e". In fact, I'm glad for this, as it > eliminates the ugliness of having to use the English "OK" (as in "All your > data has been lost ").