From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Nov 13 09:06:33 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1L0feL-0007HE-3c for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:33 -0800 Received: from hs-out-0708.google.com ([64.233.178.242]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1L0feG-0007H3-D3 for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:32 -0800 Received: by hs-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id k27so520375hsc.2 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=/kZ4JpwooG+BUhPlW9/M3z8y3PUdGW0UddqW8nTS49k=; b=iYvHOnsOuPmlv59S94QdZlxwQODO25kIutPrx01210wGGiTvpvlSlfxGWpd6qx5D8/ gKZvcxsT42XJ2CjlRhIOs+BgjDkcmRwS9nr7cDMP0+f/QD/2YJoyNzJGIMGX3kmnKirl /u2n7Wq9vpkbueU3cki9bluPNl2uPPzfkfnc4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=f7F2pRqQFDHNdxVcMTNSxOr4i5uP5xHzyVEiaAF1RIDtEw7JmKVHJHCCcWbRTVjPX2 8TBUT7mSgDsfjdRHybbu1Xrx357jxPW7cCN+edpcA7m0+mH0C2pDEszAoai5s+1uGXjb bEeM/O7uPjc1QiOPSv8W/Ai0l69Xsd3B/2STg= Received: by 10.142.147.15 with SMTP id u15mr3795993wfd.226.1226595986277; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.143.58.3 with HTTP; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 09:06:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <96f789a60811130906s16bdb1a4nc9c09a08b32e0bd5@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2008 12:06:26 -0500 From: "Michael Turniansky" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: more le lo In-Reply-To: <702226df0811130806h51c83c15k17acd2c5d2b6c45c@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <5715b9300811130732n669e3f6esce4de0b81d442f65@mail.gmail.com> <200811131055.32015.phma@phma.optus.nu> <702226df0811130806h51c83c15k17acd2c5d2b6c45c@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 1029 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: mturniansky@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 11:06 AM, Jon Top Hat Jones wrote: >> On Thursday 13 November 2008 10:32:55 Luke Bergen wrote: >> > coi. >> > >> > So, how would I express "the man(which is an actual man) reads". As in, >> > what if I want the specificity of "le" but I want the "I have an actual >> > man >> > in mind" part of "lo"? I >> > As a side note, would the following also work? > > le nanmu noi ny. cu tcidu > That is a legal utterance, but it doesn't mean what you want it to mean. As it is, it actually a sumti that means "the man, who is the man that N read about." (the bridi that is the noi clause expands to "ny cu tcidu ke'a". All noi clauses have a ke'a, which explains which sumti place the sumti that we're describing falls into. By convention, if it is not explicitly mentioned, it comes in the first available slot, although that's not required). I believe It's also an open question whether "N" can actually refer to the sumti that we're currently describing (we're 'one level deep' at the moment, if you understand what I mean), but I would say "no". --gejyspa