From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Jan 16 12:53:04 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:53:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1LNvge-0007wi-GE for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:53:04 -0800 Received: from rv-out-0708.google.com ([209.85.198.243]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1LNvgc-0007wR-20 for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:53:04 -0800 Received: by rv-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id b17so1899056rvf.46 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:53:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=RsdfW/FQrMhCP69ILxecIzmkPM0q9FPqRwnGmZZkJM0=; b=suqZ1owXIq2J3gAN871/E6hz9acGWvtf1o4x9Hnu/SkeVxX8mfiPV3OMoEXmg4RXKJ /WhMWCtKhV0ffO+IJVFMALIN5VhflGYBsDwjVV/fW2T9uWCK1euNWcl7v6JDq7DHM36a 5VpwGWF1vOhsd4q/U7+6NMXD0O8g7UBpB3ghU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=HraiQop2w1Bbd/QdxhiPG9Ep7/5S8mYEZBlOaZrlyKfFaMdCLF+T3oc7OFaF8kSosP lu88LQ1Tx1l+/0DFqXm85iFnE/5+bJYC08J5HHvwBRnz/qlVEYn6s/Ic+T768J4KsL5O mCBRkPCUNo67T9ZxMhqrsmHsQLJ/lzZTy3G9s= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.141.116.17 with SMTP id t17mr1396692rvm.239.1232139181321; Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:53:01 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <96f789a60901161156n3a6c44a7uab29eb6340a55f4e@mail.gmail.com> References: <20090113001704.GA13721@sdf.lonestar.org> <96f789a60901161156n3a6c44a7uab29eb6340a55f4e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 17:53:01 -0300 Message-ID: <925d17560901161253j4cef5b0fp115cb914307d0b64@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: xelfanva From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 1209 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:56 PM, Michael Turniansky wrote: > On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 7:17 PM, Minimiscience > wrote: >> >> "What can happen once can happen again." > > Xorxes' "so'i pa moi fasnu cu za'u roi fasnu" doesn't work. Not mine. Mine was "lo ka'e se krefu be fi li pa cu ka'e se krefu (be) fi li za'u". Now I would suggest: "lo pu'i rapli be li pa cu nu'o rapli (be) li za'u". > What about "roda noi paroi fasnu cu la'acu'i za'uroi fasnu"? (You want {poi} rather than {noi}.) I think it's a bit contradictory to claim that it happens exactly once (so not less nor more than once), and then say that it possibly happens more than once. That can be solved by thinking of different implicit tenses or an implicit ka'e, but that's tricky in such a general statement. I think I would tend to take "ro da poi paroi fasnu" as things that do happen exactly once, not things that have happened exactly once so far or could happen exactly once. >> "The truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head." >> - loi jetnu ka'e bartu .ije ku'i loi jitfa cu nenri lo stedu be do > > Again, I'd use la'acu'i rather than ka'e for "possibly" I think this is more like: .i'a lo jetnu cu bartu .iseju ku'i lo jitfa cu nenri lo stedu be do Granted, the truth may be out there. But be that as it may, lies are inside your head. The speaker is just distancing themself from the first claim. "That's something people often say, and I'm not going to be arguing with that, but be that as it may ..." I don't think the speaker is really concerned with its being possible or with its likelihood. They are just setting the stage for the actual claim they want to make, which is the second one. mu'o mi'e xorxes