From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Jun 04 02:07:57 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 04 Jun 2009 02:07:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MC8vU-0005Gb-Ji for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 04 Jun 2009 02:07:57 -0700 Received: from mail-bw0-f223.google.com ([209.85.218.223]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MC8vK-0005Ec-6E for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 04 Jun 2009 02:07:56 -0700 Received: by bwz23 with SMTP id 23so494158bwz.34 for ; Thu, 04 Jun 2009 02:07:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=1Q8FSVVPeA/JC3urUOIsZ8kwm8KjghjDMjMFSDay2yI=; b=C5uttD3YwE1Q6Rw4YmS+EkO7+rX5szVC/wf490L/K9YYd3xTo+tjmxLcznPNooN7WF WcV/zsA6oNee4xQE9wAiuYMjQa7CyUFzDiYIO6TIi0gzMJ+nX3F4KbYnVP7GeHWLh6l/ ZX9JqRBEXU9GLJfHaVbEZ4cw15t3eiJJn10UQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=LhtN7aWEtxTx0m8vS2mO3k9poAF7YrgNYBkstz8m4w+cUCD7k65rk0SiOmu1OgyDwm TNs3u+viHX9D6xTs1KFRI9n1g6OJeSDawa+VFHIGFZ0hpKgs88SP4/+BV2vaJ6yxzrfT WC5UT9e3F8jfMZIQ/qFAHGI9ZKLlnGH94AvF4= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.103.193.13 with SMTP id v13mr1137979mup.136.1244106031141; Thu, 04 Jun 2009 02:00:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20090603215731.GA6804@sdf.lonestar.org> References: <73982fe70905311909ke27958eo20e9a882a88ad4c3@mail.gmail.com> <8900cc410906010103p1d2721e4rcdf94369983d19e3@mail.gmail.com> <73982fe70906020712h236e8c5rf43c18ca4474b19e@mail.gmail.com> <4de8c3930906020942p4d14e58at3ebe43fb0ed55593@mail.gmail.com> <20090603215731.GA6804@sdf.lonestar.org> Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 11:00:31 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 4c300e5b1c9e2f8a Message-ID: <4de8c3930906040200o2ee2f0bcwe7271bdee937485e@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Pronunciation: a major problem in spreading lojban From: tijlan To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-archive-position: 1760 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jbotijlan@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners 2009/6/3 Minimiscience : > de'i li 02 pi'e 06 pi'e 2009 la'o fy. Ivo Doko .fy. cusku zoi skamyxatra. >> I would also like to add to this discussion that there are number of >> languages in which pronunciation of consonant clusters is resolved >> with schwa, although it's unconscious and, in most languages, the >> presence of schwa is not represented in the orthography. > .skamyxatra > > Lojban allows one to use any non-Lojbanic vowel between consonants as a > "consonant buffer," which only exists for ease of pronunciation and has no > other effect on the text. Was it not possible to apply that principle to the impermissible consonant pairs so that they wouldn't have required a morphological "y" but just a phonological buffer between them? So: mijycisysla -> mijcissla togytikygau -> togtikgau But: xacysantyse'u -> xacsantyse'u rircylajytigysla -> rircylajtigsla (... the impermissble consonant pairs of all of which would still be buffered phonotactically.) mu'o mi'e tijlan