From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Sep 10 12:03:46 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:03:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mlovq-0008In-HF for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:03:46 -0700 Received: from mail-yw0-f204.google.com ([209.85.211.204]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mlovj-0008Hc-OP for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:03:46 -0700 Received: by ywh42 with SMTP id 42so589893ywh.30 for ; Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:03:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=rR37G00s1Gy2XdaVxxSON46Qn8QsEQKEvS+5A84qR9M=; b=q/9ywC8SGbcmlcUVSocG0nQ4pKb199MsPz946YTzADdIVnSK1a3YN2Nu636iU9I2vn u8MSDan/f5Hbk3eTzOwi4oJJY2noNPwNPwv8SsQc7S903628Qz2UVquc86dgYmcRUucW HYGvR0pVDiQJLdHLhJIR9XDqL/2nZh/Z8UBv4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=hSebdHKnRfAxs71OaBRM/hIYmdeeQ1NFYt9bAEoxfsMTzc70PkRlabxosLEEC8ZQdS glE5MJccUqy2xTXBuh19x6b1gtjryauiusX0IpDXDnpyU65Oa+R40haq0jS3iCt4XZN6 3A/AQyzhnuq5sgtA7L2Js6D4huWBiv4XdKB9A= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.151.5.19 with SMTP id h19mr3309128ybi.264.1252609412520; Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:03:32 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <925d17560909101155h53926fe6x292aaf650a21186a@mail.gmail.com> References: <5715b9300909100844p3ec611a9hc8ee25e22b68175d@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560909100948m252a3e8blf2d4989f3b199787@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9300909101010j57bdbc72xd3a4975394fb418e@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560909101029o5116775bmc8754ebba922b866@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9300909101037s1431f0cahffbc0733e7d9b973@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560909101047r768c7699u7ced9fd918b6e078@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9300909101124o7a2ae957o1ea18621f6084169@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560909101155h53926fe6x292aaf650a21186a@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 15:03:32 -0400 Message-ID: <5715b9300909101203w1e1a0360h6c447cbc11d87376@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: kecti From: Luke Bergen To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd4b38413a8cb04733ddbb9 X-archive-position: 2302 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners --000e0cd4b38413a8cb04733ddbb9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable but even then, would a proper lojbanization of that english be something like {mi kecti lo tricu lo nu ri farlu gi'e na seltrina} 2009/9/10 Jorge Llamb=EDas > On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Luke Bergen > wrote: > > So (object)? I'm pretty sure I've seen that used a lot in the gismu > > definitions. > > Hopefully some day we'll have more standardized definitions for gismu. > I think there are cases where (object) is used in places that admit > people, but I don't know if there are any cases of that when people is > the standard case. > > > Is it possible to make it any more generic than that? Is there no way = to > > feel sorry for an event or a property? I'm thinking not. > > I think the important part is that x2 is the patient (sufferer) of > event x3, which x1 feels is bad for x2, and this makes x1 feel bad in > sympathy with x2. I guess it's hard to project emotions on properties > or events. > > mi kecti lo nu lo tricu cu farlu kei lo nu no da tirna ra > "I feel sorry for the falling of trees, that nobody is around to hear it"= ? > > Maybe. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > > --000e0cd4b38413a8cb04733ddbb9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable but even then, would a proper lojbanization of that english be something li= ke {mi kecti lo tricu lo nu ri farlu gi'e na seltrina}

2009/9/10 Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com>
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
> So (object)?=A0 I'm pretty sure I've seen that used a lot in t= he gismu
> definitions.

Hopefully some day we'll have more standardized definitions for g= ismu.
I think there are cases where (object) is used in places that admit
people, but I don't know if there are any cases of that when people is<= br> the standard case.

> Is it possible to make it any more generic than that?=A0 Is there no w= ay to
> feel sorry for an event or a property?=A0 I'm thinking not.

I think the important part is that x2 is the patient (sufferer) of event x3, which x1 feels is bad for x2, and this makes x1 feel bad in
sympathy with x2. I guess it's hard to project emotions on properties or events.

mi kecti lo nu lo tricu cu farlu kei lo nu no da tirna ra
"I feel sorry for the falling of trees, that nobody is around to hear = it"?

Maybe.

mu'o mi'e xorxes




--000e0cd4b38413a8cb04733ddbb9--