From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Fri Sep 25 16:14:29 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:14:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MrJzg-0005Wz-Mv for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:14:28 -0700 Received: from mail-bw0-f211.google.com ([209.85.218.211]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MrJzd-0005VQ-0w for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:14:28 -0700 Received: by bwz7 with SMTP id 7so2423678bwz.34 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:14:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2VGzsoaRVZXF9N+u30P3qMKEjllPbY5t3a5VWsFTIbc=; b=duRgfMRxg9ccPPW6w8F2BDJOg2AcJa5q0dk7Szp8Ic6o/gof4GUKO3Q/VOFrg8BrdG 9fWna5PqjWaY50+mfb+tVEJZneTZp+RdzwP3XqpiSvO/yI3G/1wPqN41pVIAg7L6mjlv zODJo34qu+59loYgx9ydN6+DqLqi5ehcZH6yo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=RlR5BtqniLcvDaiOgC3JU6zTxEw7aRincO5iTuG/QEaTDXBN0eTS8RBzACgEmox7U/ zMV40ikGaHxZBW0EPH//13I+xyQ0k4Y3HcgTZzQpZ3qs1fDqsQ7Mz+HYYiPjgk/TswMk gxCbGC1oGFqg7JeFsm1wS+GeYeFVPneG23j28= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.103.64.19 with SMTP id r19mr262326muk.8.1253920458463; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:14:18 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <74145aa00909251416y1fb2a156w2c458a98f5f21754@mail.gmail.com> References: <74145aa00909250740s14ae670r4ba0536ea04ccf48@mail.gmail.com> <001517741a6af8cbd30474689ce5@google.com> <74145aa00909251416y1fb2a156w2c458a98f5f21754@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 01:14:18 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 54e88f0bb50e433c Message-ID: <4de8c3930909251614t538714dfvf2b552e121b73c3b@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: =?UTF-8?Q?R:=E2=80=98There?= is the view from =?UTF-8?Q?here=E2=80=99?= question From: tijlan To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis X-archive-position: 2415 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jbotijlan@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners 2009/9/25 Dino Alfier : > Thank you for you kind help. Clearly, I still have a lot to work to do. What > I would like to express is this: From here (that is from where I am) there > is an unspecified location/place that I call ‘there’ or that I conceptualise > as ‘there-ness’. You wanted something with "jvinu", so i guess the intended sense of "from here" is "the location is seen from here" (viewpoint) rather than "the location extends from here" (endpoint). Then i suggest: jvinu ta ti (something) is-the-view-of "that-there"-location from-"this-here"-point-of-view There is a view of the location there which is seen from here. The referent of "ti", "ta", or "tu" need not be a concrete object; "ti", for instance, can just be the immediate space surrounding the speaker. tijlan