From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Wed Jan 27 20:38:58 2010 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:38:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NaM9h-00087E-P5 for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:38:58 -0800 Received: from mail-pz0-f185.google.com ([209.85.222.185]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NaM9a-000835-Fs for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:38:56 -0800 Received: by pzk15 with SMTP id 15so229279pzk.25 for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:38:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=/DFk+bpFAjoi0CV16RgxfD+bg3EB9khjAOWPA2A/3Ns=; b=Soh4fMb2vij4Dnu8VtLzmxw32yPie7mMyx7WC0KtAVzI/xFcDCrz1CbbMlemp5w9XZ 2F8HSpIzw6J/86ag5RozGtQyVgHDI2CJnoS5T8Bf7NFqPih9+yztJdK/ERXYsL7IeEn7 c4qhM5AkbERFPENKNfLY7YCbYL48/ASeqPYbk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=Qv4xBKqoeSJnprOB3tS5ZFKmGDopAdb056T4hiCt3fwnRR1svH83dg/5IZrtXCw40v VfsCg28WUKF8zDTqcXsPJ3nnMih1rwRPTH5H4prtNhaZcKN+wW4TUzZKDWPuFlVVqvAl trABcHp9UsWMPsiIJJICxNLw/S/huJBqxDTWM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.56.7 with SMTP id e7mr3515793wfa.25.1264653524785; Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:38:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <27513e551001272000n5040fe9xb88513608b33ab35@mail.gmail.com> References: <7177e42e1001271849o782ec540td05bdd005d247b09@mail.gmail.com> <1a3d02c41001271924i1a48cefq8cf87704a7abc24c@mail.gmail.com> <27513e551001272000n5040fe9xb88513608b33ab35@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 23:38:44 -0500 Message-ID: <96f789a61001272038v52367eb7x6afa296912dc660e@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: "Why should I believe that?" From: Michael Turniansky To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-archive-position: 2753 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: mturniansky@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Oren wrote: > could I rearrange the sumti and say... > { fe la'edu'i jinvi fo ma } > ...to mean "why believe that?" (without specifying me or you or whoever) You certainly can, but since the emphasis on the question is the reason for belief, it's probably better to say "ma ve jinvi fe la'edi'u" > On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 11:24, Sam Chapin wrote: >> >> For a start there's {jinvi}, "opine": x1 holds opinion x2 (du'u) about >> subject x3 for reason x4. >> >> http://www.lojban.org/cgi-bin/dict.pl?Form=dict.pl1&Query=jinvi&Strategy=*&Database=*&submit=Submit+query >> On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 9:49 PM, DataPacRat wrote: >>> >>> "Why should I believe that?" is a fairly simple phrase, and the >>> cornerstone of the scientific method and skeptical movement... and I'm >>> having a bit of a time figuring out the Lojban version. The most >>> relevant lujvo or gismu I can find dealing with belief is krici, which >>> is belief /without/ evidence or proof, the exact opposite of the sort >>> of belief I want to deal with. Another way to say the same idea in >>> English is "What evidence supports that [assertion]?", but I'm having >>> trouble figuring out the different lujvo; would >>> >>> ma xu'acmu fi ta >>> >>> translate to something like "What evidence is the basis for asserting >>> that?" >>> >>> Or should I be trying to figure out "velji'i datni" or "sidydatni" >>> mentioned in the entry for datni? >>> >>> >>> Thank you for your time, >>> -- >>> DataPacRat >>> li te'o te'a vei pai pi'i ka'o ve'o su'i pa du li no .i je'a melbi! >>> >>> >>> >> > >