From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Feb 25 14:12:37 2010 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:12:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Nklwj-0004KM-0L for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:12:37 -0800 Received: from mail-bw0-f219.google.com ([209.85.218.219]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NklwY-0004JO-Fv for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:12:36 -0800 Received: by bwz19 with SMTP id 19so5139764bwz.26 for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:12:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=ri6f8yiRISEmxeMNoYfFWN50QKu6kYx0mRXSylG5tH0=; b=XxYTXJNfUR1+iQaDV9Lr9X+FrFNioPTzcYhZhXofRTLt3reResHJoUz2yCVqgSBfA0 TMt8LZUkTd+DKQGsjXsWWxqJepLbJVGW/GiqJ6ncbN1GLqQfHmYRMdxtlH0FHhsuY8XY /NS61t+6abVzhqFLs0fITtLr2hzFB4O0355yQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=FK8byzMwO1KdsIY2TC8hnUmdhOffsRgMph8WfwFPwbOBNoj1d3nTjQdRqX4ymRgYwg Qhug86EQZPlr/cQ00b/9ddQBsVb6NPDFtnWosqZsPpmunMudEYE5TtGh1QgfKv+fjmUN 1VCedJ/9F7uIgSpysGQHkxjEF1gr4v8pVhoAM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.4.207 with SMTP id 15mr223225bks.60.1267135939456; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:12:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <925d17561002251134h7021d17cof94e9cf155267ad1@mail.gmail.com> References: <1f1080831002242001p106c6ba1k4925ec3b8ededbce@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301002242152o28dd4f62t4943b62388d3411f@mail.gmail.com> <4de8c3931002251107q28efbe99u91d9a89f3a893c09@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561002251134h7021d17cof94e9cf155267ad1@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2010 17:12:19 -0500 Message-ID: <1f1080831002251412y359ded84h334e592dd47cbf11@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Class--and non-gismu vocab in general From: Ian Johnson To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis X-archive-position: 2910 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: blindbravado@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Interesting; I'm seeing a bit more merit to this when it's presented this way. It seemed odd before, but it makes some sense now. To take this to its logical conclusion, though, how would you say "What classes are you taking this semester?" I'm not sure it'd be the same word, and if it were I think you'd be using a little flexibility in translation (a direct gloss might be something like "what teaching events do you repeatedly go to this semester?") And I don't think it can be as simple as {do tadni ma} with any combination of tenses/aspects either. Even if it were, then you run into "what's your major?" as a problem, which to me is closer to {do tadni ma} (at least based on the definition; it's not like I've really seen it in use). mu'omi'e latros. 2010/2/25 Jorge Llambías : > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 4:07 PM, tijlan wrote: >> On 25 February 2010 05:52, Luke Bergen wrote: >>> 1) You could try a lujvo like {nuncu'e} or {nunselctu}, or something similar >>> for class.  Then it would be {mi klama lo nunselctu .i co'o} >> >> I personally wouldn't object to having a NU-ed sumti as {klama}'s >> proper x2, because I think that any place is essentially an >> abstraction (and also that being aware of this would open up some >> cognitive & philosophical possibilities). > > I don't have a problem with going to an event either. > >>  But some jbopre might still >> prefer adding {tu'a}: {mi klama tu'a lo nunselctu}. > > I'm not sure about this use of "tu'a" though. Normally "tu'a ko'a" > means "lo nu ko'a co'e". "tu'a" takes a sumti and returns an event in > which that sumti is a participant. Here what you want is the place > where an event takes place. This is going in the opposite direction, > since the place could be an argument of the event. The normal way to > do it would be "lo jai bu'u nunselctu", "the place of being taught". > > I also think "nunctu" is just as good or better than "nunselctu" for "class": > > nunctu: x1 is a class given by x2 to x3 teaching x4 about x5 by method x6. > > nunselctu: x1 is a class given to x2 by x3 teaching x4 about x5 by method x6. > > "mi klama lo nunctu", "I go to the teaching" could be said by the > teacher or by a student. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > >