From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Thu Feb 25 14:36:27 2010 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:36:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NkmJn-00069N-23 for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:36:27 -0800 Received: from mail-qy0-f192.google.com ([209.85.221.192]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NkmJi-000689-VC for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:36:26 -0800 Received: by qyk30 with SMTP id 30so2057682qyk.16 for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:36:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=WeU4biIPm2ZlvECqx70d1LX4GTtOtKM2jgd/+cq8uo0=; b=YeHL7MCCZZ3g+CXpoYLBYAqUYZNgcwePKTL8+p5tFR5Ti9YyhCKZ9Ap5YQpkAFHycI LE2Mx+ot8iA7QJogS01S6em64nQYB3X5JzfUCA3B5bNWLXovqVnM/46XECOzz7wnpC+B fYwsgQASS2/E7aMWmCzAnYb+Dfkp75tMiAn/U= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=Dsk4eMHYODv8d3/hDy14VzgxgwrPZvXiIRiLi68kvOvu7rrttPE52s2ZvVmWMeLLDT SnY1zCy/TJM83Eh7aPhTCLkLzo3C9beGeQsg8qduA1EbFlNkSZa0LAKqgiTEF0twCMrx W7LfhrU1cHeVZsWgtkVPvyFkt6twzgtiAjlnE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.48.72 with SMTP id q8mr33782qaf.2.1267137375898; Thu, 25 Feb 2010 14:36:15 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <925d17561002251427h15040eb6p7256255a4d770b3c@mail.gmail.com> References: <1f1080831002250758rb17bd2dk664e035452c298e4@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561002250954p6d57ef87w3cde7fd92a9fe7d9@mail.gmail.com> <1f1080831002251318p78bab1dbha716f66a082c0daf@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301002251328o11d2223r12bf275e35e71955@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561002251336o12bddef4re5cec4b5ac32893f@mail.gmail.com> <20100225215933.GA14097@sdf.lonestar.org> <925d17561002251427h15040eb6p7256255a4d770b3c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2010 17:36:15 -0500 Message-ID: <5715b9301002251436y7ab2ba63w5e7e942e368a508f@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Tenses in abstractions From: Luke Bergen To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00c09f8995ae2c11410480746908 X-archive-position: 2912 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: lukeabergen@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners --00c09f8995ae2c11410480746908 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm confused, I always believed ZI/VA to express where/when the bridi is happening in relation to the following sumti. e.g. {mi pu citka vi lo xamsi} "I ate near the ocean" (who cares where that ocean is in relation to where we are now). How would you say that if {vi} marks how far away from the origin you are? I'm not even sure what the following sumti means in that case. Would it just translate as "I ate near where we are now (at the ocean)"? 2010/2/25 Jorge Llamb=EDas > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 6:59 PM, Minimiscience > wrote: > > > > Really? I thought "{zi ma}" meant "a short time from what?" by analogy > to "{vi > > ma}." > > There are two different views on that. I prefer to use ZI/VA to tag > the magnitude of displacement from the origin (they are after all > magnitude of displacement tags.) The other view is to use them to tag > the origin, like PU/FAhA. But then you have no easy way of tagging the > magnitude of displacement. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > > --00c09f8995ae2c11410480746908 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm confused, I always believed ZI/VA to express where/when the bridi i= s happening in relation to the following sumti. =A0e.g. {mi pu citka vi lo = xamsi} "I ate near the ocean" (who cares where that ocean is in r= elation to where we are now). =A0How would you say that if {vi} marks how f= ar away from the origin you are? =A0I'm not even sure what the followin= g sumti means in that case. =A0Would it just translate as "I ate near = where we are now (at the ocean)"?

2010/2/25 Jorge Llamb=EDas <jjllambias@gmail.com>
On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 6:59 PM, Minimiscience <minimiscience@gmail.com> wrote:=
>
> Really? =A0I thought "{zi ma}" meant "a short time from= what?" by analogy to "{vi
> ma}."

There are two different views on that. I prefer to use ZI/VA to tag the magnitude of displacement from the origin (they are after all
magnitude of displacement tags.) The other view is to use them to tag
the origin, like PU/FAhA. But then you have no easy way of tagging the
magnitude of displacement.

mu'o mi'e xorxes




--00c09f8995ae2c11410480746908--