From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sat Mar 13 16:07:25 2010 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:07:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NqbMb-00015o-KO for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:07:25 -0800 Received: from mail-bw0-f219.google.com ([209.85.218.219]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NqbMX-00011j-Uz for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:07:25 -0800 Received: by bwz19 with SMTP id 19so2269360bwz.26 for ; Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:07:15 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=E+WtrXkPIBhend5weQviOMnP3qjDlC52fUASg4CkeHY=; b=ub6vrbU6mEeZYATfqKgU8qw1rW5arlyvDrEws9N401cen5xjMRqg4eBdki/ApEtLoD CuBmxX6TQT8QzDVEq45ewEpC+TFdnQ7WHzYxYZhAbFe5Je9vZSF1eIeKn6nPb06DYDmd +qwu3MaXKoK0Nacpr/QhvrutdAELDQ8XFzZps= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=T6A6ScK1IsxE17vzsQEp0c9RIQewi+pJAUPoiqJoMWJoBrwM+82qdyszPNegHWuKeG BDC9hDr6zKqPTNxwjk4CvK3ELfMhabIFpHt2eyHtN9rO1WijQ0iBYjomtA/agVa4sT3Q +aKRrhFGmoTxjpImacXXxL1tdcx+LNdPgxrQ4= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.151.216 with SMTP id d24mr4700496bkw.1.1268525235497; Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:07:15 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5715b9301003131245n23c64a7emfa56bccba3799045@mail.gmail.com> References: <4de8c3931003130452v3473ee1ei70da65f022ac2b1b@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561003130713o346dd22lbe1cb8cf25c66f1c@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301003130746x7347e6a3u3c38970be7c55316@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561003130806t592c146k934fc70f4dfb99dd@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301003130826v38796202i1d23f3c09809ca2d@mail.gmail.com> <4de8c3931003130928m50cde388xcb631dd523f63445@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301003131245n23c64a7emfa56bccba3799045@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:07:15 -0300 Message-ID: <925d17561003131607v64d15ae1u29c42305e114c48a@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: How versatile is "nu"? From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-archive-position: 3000 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 5:45 PM, Luke Bergen wrote: > errr, lo'ai kukte sa'ai jukpa le'ai > I'm always mixing those up for some reason. OK, I see. In that case "lo nu jukpa" would normally be "lo pu'u jukpa". I suppose that by "lo za'i jukpa" you mean "being a cook" as opposed to just "cooking (something)". But consider these: (1) la djan cu jukpa "John is cooking." "John cooks." "John is a cook." (2) mi djuno lo du'u la djan cu jukpa "I know that John is cooking." "I know that John cooks." "I know that John is a cook." (3) la djan cu ruble lo ka jukpa "John is weak at cooking." "John is weak as a cook." (4) la djan cu nelci lo nu jukpa "John likes cooking." "John likes to cook." "John likes being a cook." Presumably you could distinguish "la djan cu nelci lo pu'u jukpa" from "la djan cu nelci lo za'i jukpa", so in (4) you would have the option to specify different types of "nu". But in (1), (2), and (3) you don't have the corresponding options. So if the subtypes of nu are so important, how come du'u and ka don't come with their corresponding subtypes, and how come you can't make the same distinction at the main bridi level? It just seems to me that the za'i/zu'o/pu'u/mu'e split of "nu" is not that useful, and if it was useful, it's made in the wrong place. mu'o mi'e xorxes