From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Mar 15 11:37:53 2010 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NrFAn-0007Y0-1V for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:53 -0700 Received: from mail-fx0-f210.google.com ([209.85.220.210]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1NrFAh-0007Wg-Kt for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:51 -0700 Received: by fxm2 with SMTP id 2so630053fxm.26 for ; Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=MZN9q5QH75ZqMeTA/x664Tm+mSfvo1x/Z6fJYXkyu1g=; b=WyH+gB7uoklXvM96Zu6BasjtSZG59JfpqirCo9UEVGbC/Pzdt3NpmE7Vwcg36dTN7i Iwx8CBfdswaMa+1ZxYIfQDJk6mgk8aN2gw4hLUa9+2XkwrYepZFjdeGsyWaYuH8SHBni aiZtRoEOr5BREydWSQ0WumDbnpmzGGy6SDjLg= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=OEIMuf+MaFSOdGLTvi+3Dm8me+PGcCZdsejywYtptYd0Ro/1APWyEVJ6BksF/4ywF2 Xzr5SlFJOxGP7wnA1/Hgk3Lc8+bO9MCs4gufFN7pPjwDWGXpXr5Dz0z/DtRzpvDSRCLx RJ4a6K4OIZ2aOd2zRyPMvJN1+0BuIGUVaiJ6c= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.64.83 with SMTP id d19mr3112572fai.15.1268678260519; Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:40 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <16d9defd1003151126j12806949q6f3b676b05ed35ac@mail.gmail.com> References: <4de8c3931003130452v3473ee1ei70da65f022ac2b1b@mail.gmail.com> <5715b9301003131245n23c64a7emfa56bccba3799045@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561003131607v64d15ae1u29c42305e114c48a@mail.gmail.com> <201003132351.36353.phma@phma.optus.nu> <925d17561003140741o4dda967cn5da839d5f69fdeb2@mail.gmail.com> <1f1080831003150959g65a0df85ve65508bc16cbdb0f@mail.gmail.com> <925d17561003151014p415766a4n310d69d20b72bac7@mail.gmail.com> <16d9defd1003151126j12806949q6f3b676b05ed35ac@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:37:40 -0700 Message-ID: <16d9defd1003151137mba5fc38lba8b846c6faac933@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: How versatile is "nu"? From: chris kerr To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis X-archive-position: 3008 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: letsclimbhigher@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Actually, is having {jei} redundant in this sense? Is there ever a time when you need "the truth value of" and "whether" won't do? Should {jei} then simply just be short-hand for {du'u xu kau}? codrus On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 11:26 AM, chris kerr wrote: > Wouldn't a good fix be to have: > > "the truth value of" = {jei} > "whether" = {du'u xu kau} > > Any arguments against? > codrus > > 2010/3/15 Jorge Llambías : >> On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 1:59 PM, Ian Johnson wrote: >>> So {jei} is exactly identical to {du'u xukau}? Or is there a semantic >>> difference? >> >> There are two candidate meanings for "jei". Nobody really knows which >> one is the "correct" one. One of the meanings is "du'u xukau", i.e. it >> basically corresponds to the indirect question "whether". The other >> candidate meaning is "the truth value of". "jei" is not used much, >> since we already have "du'u xukau" for "whether", and "the truth value >> of" is not something that comes up often in conversation. >> >> mu'o mi'e xorxes >> >> >> >> >