From jjllambias@hotmail.com Fri Feb 14 12:35:14 2003 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:35:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from f194.law8.hotmail.com ([216.33.241.194] helo=hotmail.com) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18jmYD-00089S-00 for lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:35:13 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:34:43 -0800 Received: from 200.49.74.2 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:34:43 GMT X-Originating-IP: [200.49.74.2] From: "Jorge Llambias" To: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: closed systems error Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:34:43 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Feb 2003 20:34:43.0550 (UTC) FILETIME=[8194DFE0:01C2D468] X-archive-position: 123 X-Approved-By: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-list: lojban-beginners la ian cusku di'e >The different velbo'e could also be different psychical and social systems. > >.i le mi'o velbo'e goi ko'a cu velbo'e > le mi'o velbo'e be da poi velbo'e ke'a ku'o > le la pavbudjo velbo'e be de poi na ka'e velbo'e ke'a Let me try to translate this. le mi'o velbo'e: "Our system" le mi'o velbo'e be da poi velbo'e ke'a: "Our system (which observes something which is observed)" The {be da poi velbo'e ke'a} adds nothing, because every velbo'e, to be a velbo'e, has to be a velbo'e be da poi velbo'e ke'a. That's even more general: if "broda" has an x2 place, then every broda has to be a broda be da poi broda ke'a. le la pavbudjo velbo'e be de poi na ka'e velbo'e ke'a: "The Buddhist so-called system". No velbo'e can be a velbo'e be de poi na ka'e velbo'e ke'a, so you are suggesting that the Buddhist system is no velbo'e. Your sentence then comes out as: Our system distinguishes itself from the Buddhist so-called "system". Probably not what you meant, though. mu'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail