From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Tue Sep 20 10:12:01 2005 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:12:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EHlez-000461-5W for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:12:01 -0700 Received: from zproxy.gmail.com ([64.233.162.207]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EHleq-00045u-Ul for lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:12:01 -0700 Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id s1so325762nze for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:11:46 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=P43CABzjk8PjqtRl/MlwAD3rTACgGLMyNGwJ2HYW0CTYIizfaJJvFwIUU5gWxF3AV7hc9JWyOELp/YXdv8Y/fA/bO/I8cziDfOreqkrHAR0WjA800mGw4B2u85fgDIn/8GuJV09afqZO0cmL3yEl4MbWUxj9pc5LhQOW3c7lVYg= Received: by 10.54.36.79 with SMTP id j79mr1885940wrj; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:11:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.140.6 with HTTP; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:11:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 13:11:46 -0400 From: Matt Arnold To: colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Your PodCast Cc: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org In-Reply-To: <200509201757.07775.colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_30267_16815533.1127236306818" References: <200509201757.07775.colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-archive-position: 2175 X-Approved-By: matt.mattarn@gmail.com X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-original-sender: matt.mattarn@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-list: lojban-beginners ------=_Part_30267_16815533.1127236306818 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 9/20/05, Colin Wright wrote: >=20 > Actually, I don't know if my comments about the PodCast will make it to= =20 > the > list - I'm having trouble getting things through. Here's a copy ... >=20 > ---- >=20 > Briefly, I think the "podcast" (whatever that is) was brilliant. I=20 > downloaded > the MP3 and transcript and am working through it, understanding the spoke= n > lojban and repeating the words. >=20 > I have a real problem with part of it, though. Throughout the letter "o"= =20 > is > being pronounced as the vowel sound(s) in these words: >=20 > low > though > toe > crow >=20 > This includes, specifically, in the word "lojban". My understanding from= =20 > the > written material is that the "o" sound should be a pure vowel, pronounced= =20 > as > in "topic" or "hot". >=20 > Can anyone enlighten me in this regard? >=20 > I'll more on to other misunderstandings after we've got some feedback on= =20 > this > one. I have to repeat, though, that this is an awesome achievement. >=20 > Kudos. .iosai >=20 >=20 > kolin. > -- > Dr C.D.Wright, Director of Innovation and Engineering > Denbridge Marine Limited, Cammell Lairds Waterfront Park, > Campbeltown Road, Birkenhead, Wirral, Merseyside, CH41 9HP. >=20 > Tel: +44 (0)151 649 4080 > Fax: +44 (0)870 051 8953 > Mob: +44 (0)7980 57 22 96 >=20 > ki'esai kalin. Notice how I spell your name. You spelled it koe-leen. (Actually, you might= =20 be correct, because I've heard of one or two Colins pronounced koelin.) You misunderstood what you have read. "Topic", "Colin", "hot", make an=20 "ahhh" sound. In Lojban this is always represented by the character "a".=20 (Lojban has no other "a" sounds such as the "a" in "Matt" or "cat.") Englis= h=20 speakers usually slur the "o" sound in "low", "crow", "toe", to blend into= =20 the "oooo" sound (from flute, root, crude) on the end of the vowel, and tha= t=20 is why "o" is almost always pronounce impurely by English speakers. Listen= =20 in the broadcast to how I try to pronouce "o" with what appears (to English= =20 speakers) to be a foreign accent. This is a pure "o". Pronounce Lojban=20 "Lowzhbahn" except without the "oo" as in "you" creeping into the end of th= e=20 letter "o". Thanks, -epkat ------=_Part_30267_16815533.1127236306818 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 9/20/05, Colin Wright <colin.wright@denbridgemarine.com> wrote:
Actually, I don't know if my comments about the PodCast will make it to the=
list - I'm having trouble getting things through.  Here's a c= opy ...

----

Briefly, I think the "podcast" (whatev= er that is) was brilliant.  I downloaded
the MP3 and transcript and am working through it, understanding the spo= ken
lojban and repeating the words.

I have a real problem with pa= rt of it, though.  Throughout the letter "o" is
bein= g pronounced as the vowel sound(s) in these words:

    low
    though
&n= bsp;   toe
    crow

This inclu= des, specifically, in the word "lojban".  My understand= ing from the
written material is that the "o" sound should be = a pure vowel, pronounced as
in "topic" or "hot".

Can anyone enlighten me= in this regard?

I'll more on to other misunderstandings after we've= got some feedback on this
one.  I have to repeat, though, tha= t this is an awesome achievement.

Kudos.  .iosai


kolin.
--
Dr C.D.Wright, = Director of Innovation and Engineering
Denbridge Marine Limited, Cammell= Lairds Waterfront Park,
Campbeltown Road, Birkenhead, Wirral, Merseysid= e, CH41 9HP.

Tel: +44 (0)151 649 4080
Fax: +44 (0)870 051 8953
Mob: +44 (0= )7980 57 22 96

ki'esai kalin.
Notice how I spell your name. You spelled it koe-leen. (Actually, you might be correct, because I've heard of one or two Colins pronounced koelin.)
You misunderstood what you have read. "Topic", "Colin",= "hot", make an "ahhh" sound. In Lojban this is always represented by the charact= er "a". (Lojban has no other "a" sounds such as the "= a" in "Matt" or "cat.") English speakers usually slur the "o" sound in = "low", "crow", "toe", to blend into the "oooo" sound (from flute, root= , crude) on the end of the vowel, and that is why "o" is almost always pronounce impurely by English speakers. Listen in the broadcast to how I try to pronouce "o" with what appears (to English speakers) to be a fore= ign accent. This is a pure "o". Pronounce Lojban "Lowzhbahn"= ; except without the "oo" as in "you" creeping into the end of the lette= r "o".
Thanks,
-epkat
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