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Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2005 15:51:19 +0100
From: Thomas White <winterwhite9257@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Difficulties and frustrations
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Jessica,

I chose to say glinanmu, knowing the option of gliprenu precisely
because I am a nanmu... Ah, wait. I see. I said "This is coming from a
..." and the (oh joy!) ambiguity lies in the 'this', was I referring
to the email _I_ was writing or the soundbyte that brought up the
opinion withing that email? Heh. Well, I was referring to the author
of the email, me, a glinanmu. I suppose I should have said gliprenu as
a safety in case I happened to be voicing a question common to other
english people...

And yes, you're right about the lack of fluency. It is, as I said, the
desire to run before knowing how to walk. I just can't _wait_ to get
to that point though! :)


Jorge, you asked:

"Were you really able to get all the sounds right without figuring out
the words first?"

Yes, but I had to play-pause-play-pause quite a bit, and only
messed-up on the part ...lenudoco'a... because I'd _heard_ lenudo'co'a
(very slight h...). The only reason I was able to 'figure it out' was
because I wrote it all in one long bit, putting spaces where he
breathed, and then guessed and picked-out 'familiar' sounds like mi,
le, nu, do, etc. which only left the as-yet unknown gismu. I'm
impressed with lojban. It works. And no problem with samclupa and
sezyskinoi, at least in terms of transcribing them. Thanks to the
jbovlaste I found sezyskinoi as a whole definition, and broke down
samclupa.


Much, much thanks for your feedback. Reading all your answers have
helped, but more importantly have shown me that I need to go back and
re-read most of everything I've rushed through... *sheepish*

Gotta go,

fe'o mi'e tomys.

On 01/11/05, Jessica <j.shewellbrockway@virgin.net> wrote:
> All gismu have between two and four rafsi. Each gismu has two 'long
> rafsi'. These are:
>
> 1. The gismu itself (eg cukta)
> 2. The gismu minus its final vowel (eg cukt)
>
> Gismu may have zero, one or two of the following rafsi:
>
> 3. CVV (eg bangu => bau) or CV'V (eg cmavo => ma'o)
> 4. CCV (eg cukta => cku)
> 5. CVC (eg bangu => ban)
>
> {glinanmu}? Would this not be {gliprenu}, as maleness is not part of the
> definition? It seems strange and somewhat malglico (maldotco, malfraso,
> et cetera) to say that you are a 'glinanmu', but that I, or any other
> female native English-speaker, am a 'glininmu'.
>
> As for the necessity of writing it down, is that not simply due to lack
> of fluency? Any language, when you are first learning it, is hard to
> break down on the fly. When learning another natural language, most
> speakers tend to memorise 'stock' phrases, which is hard to do with lojban.
>
> It often goes unnoticed by fluent speakers, but English runs together a
> lot of words. We only actually pause when there is some kind of punctuation.
>
> fe'omi'e JEsikas.
>
>
>
>