From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Feb 26 08:29:39 2007 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 26 Feb 2007 08:29:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HLijL-00035R-BI for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 08:29:39 -0800 Received: from mclmx2.mail.saic.com ([149.8.64.32]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HLijC-00035G-LR for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 08:29:38 -0800 Received: from 0015-its-ieg02.mail.saic.com ([149.8.64.21] [149.8.64.21]) by mclmx2.mail.saic.com for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:29:25 -0500 Received: from 0015-its-exbh02.us.saic.com ([10.43.229.22]) by 0015-its-ieg02.mail.saic.com (SMSSMTP 4.0.5.66) with SMTP id M2007022611292514830 for ; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:29:25 -0500 Received: from 0456-its-exmp01.us.saic.com ([10.75.0.188]) by 0015-its-exbh02.us.saic.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:29:25 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C759C3.4786DA69" Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Forbidden triples and doubled FAs (two topics) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:29:25 -0500 Message-Id: <1189A858F8918F43BE3F9C7603C73FB4031E7BD7@0456-its-exmp01.us.saic.com> In-Reply-To: <1189A858F8918F43BE3F9C7603C73FB4031E7BD3@0456-its-exmp01.us.saic.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [lojban-beginners] Forbidden triples and doubled FAs (two topics) Thread-Index: AcdZtNKI0x2YfXvYQ4q+80h3J0ZNOQADRjYQ From: "Turniansky, Michael" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Feb 2007 16:29:25.0803 (UTC) FILETIME=[4798A7B0:01C759C3] X-Spam-Score: -2.5 X-Spam-Score-Int: -24 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-archive-position: 4049 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: MICHAEL.A.TURNIANSKY@saic.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C759C3.4786DA69 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 1) there are four explicitly disallowed triples -- ndj'', ``ndz'', ``ntc'', and ``nts" (CLL, chapter 3, just above last paragraph of section 7) 2) It is my second guess. It operates like ".e" , simultaneously making the claim about both items in that slot (CLL chapter 9, example 3.9) =20 --gejyspa, sevzi tavla=20 =20 ________________________________ From: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org [mailto:lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org] On Behalf Of Turniansky, Michael Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 9:46 AM To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Forbidden triples and doubled FAs (two topics) =20 1) I note that just as lojban disallows certain CC combinations (such as "mz") for fear they will be misheard, TLI Loglan disallows certain triples (like "ndj" which might be confused as "nj") Does lojban have any such forbidden triples? I see none such in the CRG, but don't know if the BPFK has done anything on this.=20 =20 2) An utterance of the form "le broda cu le brode fe le brodi" or even "le broda cu fe le brode fe le brodi" is grammatically acceptable, but does it have any meaning? As I see it, there are three possibilities: One) it is non-meaningful, and clearly and error; two) It implies some type of logical or non-logical connection between the argument, equivalent to "le broda cu fe brode JE/JOI brodi" (and probably specifically je or joi); or three) brodi replaces brode entirely. Has this been discussed/resolved? =20 Thanks in advance, --gejsypa ------_=_NextPart_001_01C759C3.4786DA69 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

1)       = there are four explicitly disallowed triples -- ndj'', = ``ndz'', ``ntc'', and ``nts” (CLL, chapter 3, just above last paragraph of = section 7)

2)       = It is my second guess.  It operates like = “.e” , simultaneously making the claim about both items in that slot (CLL = chapter 9, example 3.9)

 

      =             &= nbsp;     --gejyspa, sevzi tavla

 

From: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org = [mailto:lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org] On Behalf Of Turniansky, = Michael
Sent: Monday, February = 26, 2007 9:46 AM
To: = lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: = [lojban-beginners] Forbidden triples and doubled FAs (two = topics)

 

1) I note that just as lojban disallows certain CC combinations (such as “mz”) for fear they will be misheard, = TLI Loglan disallows certain triples (like “ndj” which might be = confused as “nj”)  Does lojban have any such forbidden = triples?  I see none such in the CRG, but don’t know if the BPFK has done = anything on this.

 

 2) An utterance of the form “le broda cu = le brode fe le brodi” or even “le broda cu fe le brode fe le brodi” is grammatically acceptable, but does it have any = meaning?  As I see it, there are three possibilities:  One) it is = non-meaningful, and clearly and error; two) It implies some type of logical or = non-logical connection  between the argument, equivalent to  “le = broda cu fe brode JE/JOI brodi” (and probably specifically je or = joi);  or three) brodi replaces brode entirely.  Has this been = discussed/resolved?

 

         =            Thanks in advance,

         =             &= nbsp;    --gejsypa

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